lol not to derail the point you are clearly making……but Joe Douglas recently confirmed the Jets were 100% drafting Gibbs at 15. They didn’t think any other teams would take him higher than 20. Once again the Villain knew what he was doing.
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This board is like a jealous girlfriend, they will not allow you to love Brad Holmes but also disagree with anything he does. The guy is perhaps the greatest GM in the NFL and will go down as the Franchise greatest GM ever for what he has done.
Let’s go through some of the trades that have me completely puzzled.
Giovanni Manu- Manu was a 4th rounder and we traded the 2025 126th pick (3rd rounder). Ended up Jets gets 92nd pick for us traded for 126. Jets used that ammo to get Devante Adam (he would have been nice to have last year). That is a 34 pick difference just because we wanted Manu a year early. From everything I have been told, Manu is a complete miss. Sure hope I am wrong.
Isaac TeSlaa- Obviously, this one has been talked a lot about already but to give up (3) 3rd rounders (2 future pick) for one 3rd rounder already has me upset. TeSlaa is NOT a developmental guy as he is already 23 years old and will need to see the field this year. Guy that athletic with very little production worries me. His last 6 games last year, they basically didn’t even throw him the ball. Again, why do we need to trade up for these types of players? We signed Tim Patrick off the streets before last year.
Broderick Martin- This one doesn’t bother me as much because we didn’t rob Peter to pay Paul. All the picks we gave up were from that draft class. We still gave up quite a bit. We gave up our 4th rounder and (2) 5th rounders to move up to get him. Guy have been given every opportunity to win a spot but obviously we will be moving on. Not overly upset with this mainly due to not trading away future picks.
Sione Vaki- Another one of these trading future capital. We traded a future 4th rounder, and a 5th and 6th to get a special teams guy and the 4th running back on the roster. Again, wouldn’t you want that 4th rounder today to see if we could get a DE? I know I sure would.
Like I said, we can love Brad Holmes and also question decisions made and still love the Lions at the same time. Some of you feel questioning is that youre saying Holmes sucks and we should just trust everything he is doing.
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No 4th and 5th rounders. No trade bait (draft slots) either. Two 6’s for a 4th ain’t gonna do it.
Canada is south of detroit.
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Last thing, I am looking at what we have up in this draft.
- Gave up our 3rd rounder from last year (Manu)
- 3rd Round Comp Pick 2025
- 3rd round comp pick 2026
- 3rd round pick 2026
- 4th Rounder (Vaki trade pick)
- 4th Rounder (Ratledge trade pick)
Could have easily packaged all of this to move up into the early 2nd to get a Luther Burden, Mike Green, JT Tuimoloau types. Also could have packaged our 1st rounder and all those picks to move up into the middle of the 1st round for someone as well.
Drafted Manu with our 3rd 2025
Moved down with both our comp picks…to top of 6 both years
Drafted Teslaa with our 3rd 2026
Vaki for Deandre Swift
Ratledge 4th move down to 7th
Still have 5 picks let’s see what happens
Not at all. You can disagree. But again bluntly: “I didn’t like player x, brad should have taken play A” Well who are you? Do you have unfettered access to intel, people, data, the players themselves. the NFL, the ownership, the coaches to determine who the best fit is for what they want to do. Or are you just a fan who is tracking production and some traits and having a crush on a certain player. I loved FEMI, I knew the lions loved femi because of all the visits, he was expected to go where he did and thus why some were thinking he needed to be a late 1st or early 2nd if you wanted him, yet I am not questioning Brad’s decision not to bc of the simple premise: He clearly knows something I don’t. Another example: Wanted Jihaad Campbell. He was declared at the combine as a Lion through and through. They did like him UNTIL they found out about a 3rd undisclosed injury and took him off the board completely. That was not made known to the public and we passed on him. Clearly Brad had an intel we did not.
So how many times does Brad have to say he has his own grades. Gibbs wasn’t a first rounder. Neither was Laporta and yet 2 years later and 3 pro bowls later here we are. He had Manu higher the Matt Miller or Mel Kiper and there was chatter other teams wanted him before the 4th so he made a move for a guy that if he hits is more athletic then PENEI. Check your sources bc he isn’t a miss. FYI, my lions coaching staff source…the one who knew about Ben johnson 2 years running before anyone…the one who knew fraley was coming back when ESPN was reporting he was gone to Seattle…he works with Fraley.
Lions don’t care about production. It can worry you and frankly I get the consternation. But gotta trust the process.
Same concept as MANU, just a strike out…it will happen. It’s how Brad works. Don’t like it fine. But thus far, can’t argue with the overall results. Valid concerns on this pick i get it.
There are so many guys who would be ecstatic to see a DE drafted just because his position was DE. He has to fit. Fipp wanted Vaki…wanted a probowl special teams ace. That draft was weak…they got their guy.
No. Bring valid legit intel to support take. Not personal opinion. @Thats2 (sorry brother, was trying to leave you out of this) brings intel and numbers and hours of tape to his conversations. I learn from him. I am just an information guy, That’s and @CuriousHusker are the tape junkies. And even at the end of the day you don’t see them throwing fits…That’s wanted Horton. i wanted horton.
I told That’s its a pet peeve that perhaps it a little too ingrained in me. I learned it when I was at the DOD working with a guy who had been in mutiple cabinets for reagan and clinton…he was so respected he worked on both sides of the line. He said “kid, politics are like an onion, 50 layers of skin. The gen pop knows 2-3 layers and argues ans debates over these layers. The guys on the inside know all 50 layers ans need all 50 layers to make a decision and you can apply this to life”.
and at the same time is a message board and fans want to just talk so have at it. Personal pet peeve. carry on.
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Hahah classic line
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I am absolutely not a tape junkie. My angle comes from CFB fantasy footballl and an obnoxious and increasingly useless interest in college sports recruiting.
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I can’t help but wonder if the plan is to resign smith?
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I feel like you do. I love Brad and think, in general, he has done a great job (awesome job) building this team. Not addressing Edge so far in this draft is blowing my mind. It was considered one of, if not our biggest needs, and instead, he gives up assets for a WR that will be lucky to make the team, let alone dress for games. I did not expect a trade-up for Abdul Carter, but moving to get JTT or the edge from Arkansas would have been nice. What I really don’t like is the attitude he gives in the press conference, like it’s crazy even to be asking about the glaring hole that is edge that he still hasn’t addressed.
The thing is that it’s also a short term need. I think we need to accept that this entire season might be a write off for Alim, Reader is old and prone to injury, Wingo is also coming back from a serious injury and Levi well… we know his injury history. The interior is filled with guys injured, coming back from injury or injury prone so Williams definitely fills a short term need as well and is plug and play so he’ll get plenty of reps.
In terms of EDGE, it’s a real issue that I’m quite frankly shocked that Holmes has ignored outside of bringing that band aid Davenport back but maybe Za’Darius is being brought back? Otherwise, a bit baffling that it hasn’t been addressed.
QBHater90, appreciate your responses and they are fairly valid. As for me sources, I definitely have my own as well (you can look at my past posts, if interested). I completely disagree with what you’re saying on the Manu development. When you’re a baby giraffe, of course you’re going to develop. Whether you can actually play against real NFL starters is a completely different thing. As for what I have heard about him from my sources, I will keep that to myself.
You think so little of Brad’s evaluation of talent, but you Love Brad. That must be tough love,
Z will re-sign after the draft. Then you all can loosen the nooses that are around your necks.
Brad has been here for 4 years.
Sewell- All Pro x 2… Pro Bowl x 3
Hutch- Pro Bowl
Gibbs- Pro Bowl x 2
Laporta- pro bowl
Brian Branch- pro bowl
Kerby Joseph- All pro
Amon Ra Brown- All Pro x 2, Pro Bowl x 3
So in 4 drafts we have landed 3 All Pro, and Hutch clearly would have been last year, and this averaged 1 new All Pro per year, and Gibbs is surely trending that way…
When you consider that Alim McNeill nor Jamo or Jack are listed above… that’s 10 pretty amazing players under 25-26 years of age Brad has amassed.
—- what many in here don’t understand is that it’s possible Brad and his team may have deemed this draft to only have 3 or 4 players at edge that THEY project better than Davenport, Paschal, Muhammad and maybe even Z Smith-
I get that notion that they expect Tate to be the starting LG or RG (I know he plays RG, but his freaky athleticism could make him our new MOVE guard like Jonah was)- and on a small sample size… Mahogany graded 71 at LG and 90 at RG, and Glass is better at RG too. Either way they believe Tate will be a 5-10 year starter and so do I.
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I think it’s just a matter of money getting a deal done
I think both sides want it done
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Guys like Jonah Jackson and Aaron Banks get 17-19MM AAV deals to be slightly above average to good OGs….
I bet Tate will be as good or better than either!
The Packers paid a fortune for Banks and a mid 1dt for LVN (who I liked in that draft btw) and got a guy with a 65 rating (60 pass rating) and a edge who has 3 sacks and a 55 rating in year 2.
18.5M AAV - 65 rating
1st rounder 4.5M aav 55 rating 3 sacks
Tate Ratledge- I expect 65 plus rating as a rookie
Muhammad- 1.5M 60 rating 3 sacks in half the snaps
PS-
2024 Draft: of the edge players taken at #28 or beyond just one player had more than 3 sacks, and Jonah Ellis (5 sacks) was more of an OLB in a 3-4 than an edge.
There were 3 DTs taken at #28 or later with 3 or more sacks- M Smith, K Jenkins, and Fiske
2023 Draft: if you go back to 2023 you add Yaya, B Young, and Tuli Tuipolotu as guys who averaged more than 5 sacks per their first 2 years.
Again Days like Breese and K Turner at DT have been up there with the top edges.
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Your the guy. I was trying to remember the poster who was hinting Manu was a bust. We will find out…I respect your confidence.
love it! perfect → out of likes since 9 hours ago. lol
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