How much do you think Patricia and the

Lions having to wait to hire coaches has effected their ability if Any? Remember, the Lions couldn’t even talk to Patricia till after they lost in the Super Bowl,. by then the best coaches were taken. This could be why JBC stayed also. this seems like a pretty big thing to me, I remember the Lions pitching a fit about it trying to get the rules changed after the fact.

I think that there is some substance to that. When you have a late start you never get the cream of the crop. I also understand keeping JBC, as Patricia is a D minded coach so his contacts for these hires are stronger!

With him not having much OC experience outside of Josh Daniel’s I knew that would be more difficult. Our O the last few years was OK, not spectacular, but OK…so why not give JBC a chance to see if he was being hamstrung by Caldwell. Now we know what JBC really is so it’s easy to move on from.

I have never been a fan of sweeping everyone, as you could be brooming out a great coach who meshes really well with you…in this case that wasn’t what happened, but I still think it was the prudent move by Patricia.

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Every year you have to wait for the best coaches to be available.

Patricia coming to Detroit was the biggest open secret in the NFL.

We could have still hired any assistants he wanted before he got the job. See Indy for example.

I think this is just the fanbase rationalizing shitty coaching choices.

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Well, that apparently is not how it went my friend. I remember the lions trying to get the rule changed saying it was unfair.

I think there are a lot of players and coaches that have most likely not lived up to his expectations. I’m guessing that extends upward, too, into the front office, considering some of the guys out there playing right now.

I do look forward to the end of the season and the beginning of a Patricia-led reset to the roster and coaching staff.

While I think Patricia getting hired late may have affected the process, here’s a simple fact. Shitty coaches?

After an expected tough start to the year on defense, they have come alive in the 2nd half of the season. Guys who were invisible are now visible. Davis has gotten better. Robinson has gotten better. We picked up guys off the scrap heap who’ve turned in performances. We even benched Tabor, who was a project that didnt pan out. How many times have we watched the Lions force feed guys they want to succeed, like Tomlinson?

Now, the chronic disappointment. Its the offense. Clear as day. Well, what coach did we keep there? The one that Stafford DID force feed on the organization. The one who was a constant, so his unit should’ve carried the team. RB’s have been fine to good. We havent had many fumbles (bye Ameer!) Offensive line has been a revolving door, and yet we avg over 100ypg. Unheard of in Detroit during the post-Barry years.
It isnt the offensive line. Losing Jones seriously hurt the WR’s. Losing Tate was overrated as hell. We were 3-4 with Tate. Best game Tate played, we lost in Dallas. Tate was NOT the key to this offense.

Hey, we might change our TE coach, that unit needs help. However, aren’t we watching TE’s dropping back to play FB, and still doing a solid job? Thats coaching. We need a talent infusion for sure. Roberts isnt good, and was expected to offset the targets for Ebron. Toilolo was expected to be a blocker and has turned into a decent receiver. This position needs to, and will be addressed in the draft.

At the end of the day, as so said by Valenti in his epic 10 minute rant yesterday, this season falls squarely on the shoulders of Stat Padford. His 4th quarter magic is gone, because teams arent playing prevent on him anymore. From GAME 1, Stafford has been off. He is paid to be the best player. He hasnt even close to lived up to that. Your leaders must be your best players. We dont have that. Ive said it repeatedly. Stafford is AVERAGING over 1 turnover per game in his career. Folks, its been 10 seasons. He isnt improving. We all said we wanted to see Stafford with a running game. Averaging 100ypg IS a running game! He still makes rookie mistakes. They already had the stat, he is the WORST QB in the league, rookies excluded, when facing pressure.

Guess what every team in the NFL has figured out? Pressure Stafford, and he chokes the game away. Back off, and he can rally a team when running his little assortment of plays. However, when teams play him hard and pressure the hell out of him, he folds up. Now, unlike most people, the Lions wont magically get better if someone else plays. However, this year someone needs to burn the hell out of Staffords feet holding him to the fire. This season was strictly his fault. He got what he wanted, got the coach he wanted, and proceeded to crap the bed from day 1. Hell go back to training camp, and reports were that he wasnt connecting with receivers like in 2017.

I fully expect JBC to be gone in 2019, and he will find a job somewhere else. I think he is a decent coach. Just needs more experience and seasoning. I also expect, as we’ve seen this year, that Patricia is going to continue taking the ball out of his QB’s hands, and he’d be right to do so. Letting Stafford do his “thing” hasnt worked for 10 years. How about we actually do what we wanted all along, which is become a more rounded running-ball control team that plays good defense. Thats a proven system. Stafford left to his own devices is a proven liability.

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Well said.

Thank you sir

Now, as for what I’d do for next year, Id do a lot of what Chicago did. Its also what the Rams did for Goff. Nagy admitted, they copied the Rams formula for Trubisky. Keep in mind, year 1 everyone said Goff was a bust. Year 2 and half of this year, he was a GOD. Now, he is a bust again. Ask yourself, what changed?

Answer. Cooper Kupp was lost. You want to see a key to an offense, there it is.

Now, what did the Rams/Bears to do help their QB? They loaded their wr’s with playmakers. The key to the Bears offense is Tarik Cohen. That little speedster smurf keeps defenses running all over the place. The Lions need to go out in free agency, and sign some fast, small WR’s that can completely stretch out a defense. Tate did some of this. He just wasnt as explosive as Kupp is in LA, and as Cohen is in Chicago. The Lions have 2 damn good WR’s in Jones and Golladay. Tate WAS expendable. However, TJ Jones is no good. and thanks to injury, he now has to be a starter, which is shameful. That leaves us Andy Jones taking snaps. Im happy for Andy, he is making the most of his time. Good for him for getting his NFL TD, thats awesome stuff. That being said, he cannot be a guy who was counted on.

Patricia loves to say that most NFL games come down to a handful of plays. I dont think we need to load up on gadget guys, but we need 2 new WR’s to go with Golladay/Jones. We need a possession receiver. This is what Johnnie Morton did. Amendola did it. Welker did it. Tate did it. Guys who dont need supreme athleticism, but guys you can count on to make every tough catch. Bail out guys. Then, we need a speedster gadget guy. We kinda sprinkled in Agnew here, but this player needs to be dedicated to the offense. He could even be a RB-WR, but they need a mismatch player. This is the kind of player that can win you those individual matchups that make a few plays a game that help you win. They dont need to carry the team, but they need to be a big part of it.

I know we have 9 picks in the draft. If I had my druthers, it would go something along the lines of (not in order here)
CB (#2 opposite Slay)
QB (To groom for 2019 and push Stafford, be ready for 2020 if needed)
S (Walker will replace Quin, but we will need another S to spell Diggs)
WR (Possession specialist)
WR (speed specialist)
TE (To replace Roberts)
LB (always need more depth)
DL (pass rushing specialist)
RG (To replace Lang)

Take those guys in any given order, BPA. Now, you can also find some help in FA, but Im much more keen on building in the draft. FA costs money and commitment, I prefer cheaper FA’s for depth. Draft picks should always be stacking positions and developing a talent pipeline

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I think Stafford is zero percent of the problem here and to blame him is insane. you get pressure on any QB and they struggle,

0% of the problem? Averaging over a turnover a game is NOT part of the problem? Remind me again what every single coach/analyst/football guy knows the only stat that truly determines the outcomes of games is? Its turnovers.

If Stafford is 0% of the problem, that also makes him 0% of the solution. How can the guy who RUNS your offense, be 0% part of a problem or a solution?

Youre obviously a hater.

Not at all. You just can’t argue with logic. Trust me man. My friend and I went back and forth on this. A hater has an irrational opinion, as does a fanboy. Ive made this comment before. Do you know what Stafford’s career QB rating is? Its on par with Andy Dalton. Do you want Andy Dalton to be QB of the Lions? Making 27 million a season? I don’t.

I made another long post. Including games played, TD’s, turnovers (int’s + lost fumbles) Stafford and Jay Cutler were dead on par, with Stafford a slightly better TD per game ratio. I mean within single percentage points. Thats including the GOOD years.

Whats best for the Lions is for Stafford to get his ass in gear, and you have to be in straight denial if you think he wasn’t part of the problem. The Lions biggest problem is offense. Their QB captains the offense. Their RB’s have been solid (100ypg for the season!). WR’s, lacking for sure. TE’s, yep bad. All that said, the highest paid guy must carry the team, especially in an offense he requested stay on and an offense he knows. That hasnt been the case. I presented my ideas for what the Lions need to do to get Stafford better, but you’ve yet to refute one of my points.

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Tell me what is the difference between Staffords big years and now an off year.

Honestly, not much. In terms of team success, the Lions still averaged 8 wins. Some seasons 7 wins, some seasons 9. I dont need to go into the breakdown of Staffords statistical analysis which shows most of his production occurs in 4th quarters. It is there though.

Now, tell me which year were Staffords worst years. 2014, and 2018. What happened in 2014? We won 11 games. In 2018, the team defense to start the year wasnt up to par. It is now. Yet Stafford started the season poorly, had 5 good games and promptly went in the tank.

Staffords best years, were 2011, 2015 and 2017. Heres what I think. 2011, Stafford/Linehan’s offense was still new to the NFL. 2012, NFL DC’s adjusted. Remember the very opening game of 2012, Stafford threw 3 picks by halftime. Kinda like 2018 Jets. Teams were guessing the plays.

2015 - Remember what happened? We changed OC’s midstream to JBC. Started 1-7, finished 7-9. DC’s didnt know how to defend a new offense.

2017 - Solid season in general, however the turnovers here were crazy high. 10 picks, 7 lost fumbles. Thats 17 turnovers in 16 games. Can’t happen

Look at Staffords turnovers through his career (again, picks plus fumbles lost)
2009 - 21
2010 - 2
2011 - 17
2012 - 21
2013 - 23 - Goodbye Linehan
2014 - 15
2015 - 15 (goodbye Lombardi/welcome JBC)
2016 - 12
2017 - 17
2018 - 15

If turnovers are the absolute killer for a football team, then how can you say a guy who is literally causing more than 1 turnover a game is not a factor or problem? Thats like saying Ameer Abdullah wasnt an issue fumbling away kickoffs or running the ball? Didn’t we all want him gone for the same reason?

My biggest beef with Stafford, honestly, is someone needs to let him know he is NOT as good as he thinks he is. Oh, he is good. You CAN win with him. Not at 27 million a year. Stafford is a chess piece. He is NOT THE guy. Not many are! Stafford needs help, but you cant make that much money and be only a piece to the puzzle. Stafford’s fumbles, are primarily carelessness with the football. IE, one hand on the ball during a collapsing pocket. Good QB players do not do this. Stafford also holds the ball too long, exposing himself to blindside hits. We beat GB in Detroit this year watching Rodgers make the same cardinal mistake. You simply cant do it. You have to know to get rid of it, and live another down

We brought Caldwell, who everyone is fawning over now, in to tame Stafford’s turnovers. He had marginal success, and so did the Lions. Now again, how can you expect to call yourself an elite player, and a cornerstone, when you are contributing to the one statistic that kills a football team’s chance at victory?

You just are blinded by your dislike of him, You want to place the blame on one player which is just stupid. Most teams play to get to the 4th qt and be close and because the Lions have been sub par that means the Lions have to cut it loose in the 4th qt. He was the main reason they won all those games 3 seasons ago That and he had a pretty good receiving core unlike now. Only a moron would put blame on Stafford for what’s went on this year or someone that just dislikes him no matter what.

Stafford is part of the problem. If he is to be part of the solution, the team needs to make the playoffs in 2019, as if he is 11 years in with no playoff wins, deserved or not, he will be seen as part of the problem (IMO fairly) as will his contract and he will be moved, if not after 2019, then For Sure after 2020 with 12 years of no actual success in the way it should be measured…championship contention.

Okay, why does Aaron Rodgers suck this year?

Anyone watch Cam Newton lately? You pressure almost any QB and they will struggle. Stafford takes some blame but i don’t think there’s too many QBs out there who would make our offense productive right now.

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I would rather accept the facts, than try to make them fit.
You want reasons. We spent 17 million for nothing on Ziggy Ansah. We suffered constant injury to Ansah, T.J. Lang, Decker and Wagner. We traded Golden Tate. Struggling against the run wasn’t a coaching thing. Snacks came in, he’s being coached by those same coaches. Take the two top receivers and the top RB from any team in the league and two of the five starters off their OL and no team in the league will prosper. Five of your top 11 offensive starters. Think a little about it. Not excuses. Just facts.