Lions defense gets a bad rap

And we got kinda lucky Fields got hurt in the 2nd Bears game, he had 100 yard rushing in the 1st ■■■■■■■ quarter! lol

1 Like

Looking at it through Honolulu Blue colored glasses doesn’t really change the fact that the defense sucked last year. It just changes your perception.


Looking at the defense like it progressively got better…welll…it did.
Noticing the pattern of trending upward and expecting more of the same, because every shred of evidence points to the idea that it will…it most likely will.

Faith in the Sheila
Faith in the Brad
Faith in the Dan
Faith in the Lions

Competent winners form top to bottom in this organization.
They fired all of the SOL management
New Lions management
New Lions coaches
New Lions Players

…New Lions fans are the last thing of the culture to shift



This is an extremely talented roster. There’s zero reason this roster should suck. There’s plenty enough talent on this roster to be above average.

Me as well… obviously injuries are always a factor but this roster should be above average.

I expect this to be improved but I still expect this to be our weakest link.

Good thread with some nuanced discussions from both sides. Would read again.

Better, yes . . . Above average, talk about Honolulu Blue colored glasses, it’s altering your perception.

I agree with both of you. I fully appreciate your view of it from a dollars standpoint. But I can also see Air’s point about the guys we have on that side of the ball, which includes using premium resources in lieu of big money. Holmes has used (9) picks in the top 100 on defense.


I would say that my biggest concern about the defense for next season is my perception that the Dline needed some help also. Now maybe I just do not know crap (possible and maybe even probable) and the coaches know that the problem in the run game was more due to the LB and Safeties not making the proper fits in the holes. But that is the area of concern for me. That it felt like the DT position needed some beefing up (pun intended) and that did not happen. Now maybe it was more an issue of injuries and the hope is they will stay healthy.
On a positive they definitely brought in bodies and hopefully better players in the LB and Secondary groups. So it is not like they did not work on improving the defense. They have definitely tried.
This season can not come soon enough.

I like Dead’s point that you basically get what you paid for and there wasn’t much talent on the Lions D in 2021 or 2022. We had almost no guys who had defensive success in the league on Sundays. Romeo Okwara did but he was injured in 2021. Charles Harris was a busy until 2021 then he was injured. Tracy Walker is a question mark. Anzalone was let go from the Saints for a reason.

The 2023 Lions now have a few guys who have had success in the league: CB Cam Sutton, CJG, now Kirby Joseph and Hutch. The Commish. Moseley.

But serious questions remain. Alim has not had a full season if dominant play. Buggs is still an unknown. James Houston May still be a role player. Is Levi O. healthy enough to play? What can Romeo do now that he should be healthy? Can Tracy Walker and Joseph play together?

This defense has more pieces now, they should be better but there are legit concerns.

The 2022 Lions underperformed on defense. They also had WAY more question marks. How in the hell did Rodrigo get to play at all for example? Buggs was a late cut claim. Commish was a bust before he got here.

With more investment Will the defense be better? They should.

1 Like

This big fella might have something to say about that! If he becomes a mainstay at the point of attack this season, the DL should be just fine.

1 Like

So, the article I posted yesterday would suggest to me why we were so bad on 3rd down. The QB’s were the one’s getting many of those first downs is my bet but I am not inclined to run back through every play to prove it. These were not scripted runs for the most part, simply QB’s seeing openings and making sure that they could move the chains. This doesn’t prove the need for a QB “spy”, it instead proves the need for players to maintain their control over their assigned area’s of the field. In other words, “stay in your lane”. We were young and also had a fair amount of guys who hadn’t played together.

It got better. After letting GB make over 54% of their 3rd downs in game 8, in game 17 they only made 33% of their first downs and AR was no longer their leading rusher like he was in game 8. In fact for the last 4 games our 3rd down numbers couldn’t have been more consistent, 33% in all 4. Carolina was an outlier because they seldom got to 3rd down but it was 33% when they did. They have to be disciplined in their roles and in game 1 vs KC this season we’ll find out in a hurry if they can be.


Coaches will help a ton too.
I think we could still have the potential to be a bit soft in the middle, buuuuuuut…I think we have a lot of guys that are the type who create turnovers …Hutch, Houston, Kirby, Sutton, etc.

I’m thinking coaching, along with some opportunistic players will end up winning the turnover battle often. I think we will have a very hight +/- turnover ratio, along with being around 15 ranking on defense. :wink:

#1 rank offense
Fox on sT

We’re gonna stomp some ass

I envision an offense that scores a lot & takes them out of their plan…so opposing offenses become more predictable.
I see TOP being in our favor usually.
I’m thinking thier offense will be more predictable as they try to keep up with our Offense
I think our defense will be better than it actually is because of the above mentioned, as well as adding in coaching, culture, faith that our guys have, and more.

I think the article has a good grasp on the situation. However it opens up kind of odd. But after reading thru it, the author is mixing Sam Darnold up with someone else. He said the 19 yards rushing we gave up to Darnold was his career high. That is incorrect. It wasn’t even Darnold’s season high.

Here is a 46 yard run by Darnold.

Here he is running over a linebacker for a 1st down

Here is a quick clip of a 15 yard scramble and 12 yard TD run vs the Cowboys

1 Like

Assuming the offense keeps the 2022 pace, which is entirely reasonable given upgrades at RB and better health on the OL, the defense only needs to be middle of the pack, the definition of average.

So how can the Lions defense be at least average? Let’s look at the three levels…

DL: Solid potential to be average here. The strength is outside, clearly. Hutch is the stud but then they have a bunch of guys who can rotate and keep the heat on opposite him. Houston, Romeo, Paschal, Commish. Very nice supporting cast here. Inside is of course the question. MacNeil is who we hope takes a big step forward and looks like the guy he did vs. the Giants. Dude seems to have his heart set on getting a long term eight figure per year second contract and good for him. After that are question marks, but Buggs’ should be solid in his second year in the system. Can Levi contribute? And can Martin get up to speed quick? He’s a mountain of a man with a huge wingspan who really needs to work on pad level and leverage to get a lot of snaps on first and second down. On third down we get Commish and Paschal moving inside. Does this group have the grown men to be at least average. Yep. In fact, it would be very disappointing if they didn’t, especially with Campbell manning the middle vs. the run.

LB: An even bigger question mark than DT coming into the season. Can Campbell step in and take this group to the average tier? Remains to be seen, but Anzalone is the definition of average and coupled with Rodrigo and Barnes hopefully taking another step forward, I can see this group becoming a solid enough unit we can call average in 2023.

DBs: Here’s where we can see the defense taking a huge step toward being at least middle of the pack. They didn’t muck around here. They brought in three free agents who are smart and experienced and in the prime of their careers in Sutton, CJGJ and Mosely. Getting Walker back and having kids like Joseph and Jacobs hungry to contribute should be make them at least average.

I think the floor of this defense is 15. The ceiling? Who knows. I don’t think getting closer to 10 is out of the question.


I would have Branch ahead of Joseph.

Holy shit, man! Is he that good?
Joseph is gonna have a minimum of 7 interceptions this year…maybe even 10+

I misread that post, I was thinking undrafted Joseph not Kirby.

I think the big fella might have a pretty big learning curve due to the level of competition he played against in college. Gotta get him a ton of reps vs guys like Big V, Rags, Jonah, etc. Get him used to what nfl o-lineman are like.


This topic was automatically closed 90 days after the last reply. New replies are no longer allowed.