I agree with this whole post. I have stated several times I think he goes mid 1st, 12 - 24.
I also said if he is there at 32-34 and the Lions can address some other needs (S or WR) in FA then I would be good with them taking him there IF they think they can him to his potential (I hope if they take him that high they should feel that way).
I just watched the first series replay from the game and my take is different from several other’s on here. Will just leave it at that.
Thanks for posting
I’m in the same camp as you. I like him but not at 2OA and to be honest I’m not sure I like him with the rams pick either. Even though he probably won’t last that long.
If the Lions decided to trade down from 2OA and take him then I wouldn’t mind to bad but if we’re trading up from the Rams pick to get him than I won’t like it. Even though I like the kid.
If he slides in the draft and we get him round 2 I am much more on board with that. I’m willing to take the gamble at that point.
If Malik was a turn key prospect, with his level of athleticism, we’d be looking at a prohibitive favorite for #1oa, and we’d be looking at a costly prospect of trading up to get him, even for one spot. It’s because of his raw nature that we even have a shot. His worth is determined by nfl gms, and our opinions are irrelevant. I don’t have to argue with any of y’all about his value; it will be evident come draft day. Malik is a lottery ticket, and a chance to turn a perennial loser into something special. It doesn’t come without risk or cost, and it never will.
I’d like to make a point mostly about his athleticism and speed, since it’s been alleged as not that special by some. On this play, Malik starts out with an impressive escape from a sure sack, and is the furthest player to the right sideline in the first pic. Against future NFL talent, he reverses field and out runs the entire defense, to become the furthest player to the left sideline, nearly scoring from 40. Pretty impressive stuff, particularly the burst he showed when he decided to commit to the run.
Goff takes a 5 yard sack there. Net difference between Goff and Willis on this play? 4th & long from the 45 yard line vs 1st & goal from the 5.
There have been a couple of puzzling accusations…
You know, the guy is a project, there’s no doubt. There are enough legitimate question marks about his ability to see and read defenses and his ability to anticipate well enough to put the ball where it needs to be before the receiver opens himself up. There’s enough to shy away. No need to make stuff up. Guys should give the dude credit where it’s due. He’s an interesting prospect, but there are some huge areas that a team will be gambling on.
I can’t speak for others but my thought process is driven by the belief that Goff is actually a fairly decent starting QB if given the right situation. It happens often in today’s world that group think snowballs and I think that has happened with Goff. I think there is now a wide held perception that he’s absolutely wretched and I disagree with that.
I’m also still having trouble with the old adage of accuracy being hard to teach. But that’s why I whiffed on Allen and Herbert so bad so perhaps I need to reevaluate that.
That being said, Willis with the Rams pick? Sure why not. Doubt he falls that far though.
I imagine that you find the same thing I do when scouring outside sources; Detroit is considered to have a need at QB. I can’t count the number of times that I’m confronted with that when listening to non-Detroit commentary.
In Detroit, though, that’s not assumed by all to be the case. I think all of us (like, literally, ALL) would be content with waiting another year on Goff.
But then question arises as to whether or not Willis is a franchise QB. If he is and you’re picking #2 overall, do you walk away from that?
At the end of the day, I don’t think they’ll pick him because they’re going to want an immediate payoff from pick 2. Still, I feel a little bit like we’re in 2020 again. It’s not exactly like that, but we’re content to pass on a possible franchise QB because you possibly have one on the roster?
What if we draft him AND Goff takes a step forward as a QB? Would that be all bad?
I don’t know. Early onset Analysis Paralysis on my part, I suspect.
From an opportunity cost standpoint, absolutely it would be bad.
I know we’re all feeling positive about the direction of the team, but it is still objectively bad with major talent deficiencies nearly everywhere. It is unforgiveable in this situation to draft another QB if you think the guy you have is top-half in the league.
This team needs playmakers on defense and at WR, and there are a finite number of draft picks to use. Getting Malik Willis means not getting a guy like Hutch, Hamilton, London, Dean, etc.
Would that be all that bad at pick 31/32? No. As long as it’s not at 2 I think you’ll see the reasonable posters rally behind whatever QB we might take. As I’ve said I prefer Corral bc I think he’s a much more natural thrower of the football. And quite frankly I think the critiques of Corral’s game are even sillier than those of Willis.
But Pickett, Willis, Ridder, Howell, Pickett … if we take any of those guys with the second first I can live with it. It may not as much say that the team doesn’t believe in Gott but the team believes athleticism at that spot is becoming essential in today’s game.
RBs can have a good arm, as well as any other position player. It’s not all that unusual, just like a QB can have a weak arm
First read and run, sorry I’ve watched 4 games, and yes, in the pocket that’s his Achilles, when he rolls out he does do better.
Yes, like you said he has faults, and yes those are 2 of them. 3rd is a big fan as well, and I’ll bet he’s seen it too. I know he’s watched several games as well
The other issue, if you take him at 2 especially, is are you going to be able to sit him the time he needs?
We know Goff is going to have bad games, every QB does. Will the screams for Willis to take over be too much to deal with?
You took him 2OA. Put the kid in and let him learn. You know that’s what’s going to be said. Even by those here who have said he needs time to learn the game/ fix his issues.
Does “He needs to sit a year” go out the window?
There are things prospects CAN do. There are things prospects CANNOT do. Then there are things that prospects don’t do well consistently yet. What tends to happen is if you say here is a freaking example of a prospect actually doing something well and someone points it out, we are declaring him savior of the Lions. Meanwhile others see an example on video of a prospect doing something well, and the first words out of their mouths are… welll… huff… uh… huff… here are other examples of him not doing it well, so quit calling him a savior of the Lions. Is someone really trying to be right here??
Yeah, same here. For kicks I rewatched the Lions/Cards game and saw a lot of bad high throws when the D line got closer to him. He throws a nice ball at times but the lack of height and consistency of Willis takes him out of #2 consideration and for me, likely until the 3rd round. Not impressed with his pocket production. He’s fast for sure, but I want a QB who can evade the rush (not just take off running), but be super productive/accurate while in the pocket.
For the record, not for Willis at 2. But to address the question, YES you sit him. Mahomes and Lance were high picks and their teams allowed the vets to play. Same with Fields until injury hit. Do you draw up plays for a guy as dynamic as Willis starting in September 2022. Heck yes you do. But the QB1 is Goff no matter where you take Willis. It buys time to improve the team around him and to teach him all the nuances he needs to improve on. I don’t think fan pressure is going to hit a 2nd year staff.
I do worry if we play the wait on QB game and Goff proves to not be the guy and we are going into year 4 going… guys be patient we have a rookie QB and don’t want to throw him to the wolves. Check back on us in year 6 won’t be what the natives will want to hear. This is why I’m interested in a trade down/trade up for Willis this year. We’ll see by year 4 if we were just enamored by apparent competency or looking for our next shiny new ball staff. If they roll with Goff and were wrong, do you give them a couple extra years to see if they can hit on a drafted QB? Likely having to sell the future to go get him? Careful what you wish for. Hearing well the QB prospects were going to be stronger in the 2024 draft won’t feed the beast…
I like Willis just not at 2, and would be ok with him say anywhere past pic 10. Get your blue chip with #2 then if they really like him get him. I think if there not sticking with Goff get him so he can sit a year or 2. Goff just got his confidence back drafting this kid would probably set him back also. There is alot to think about here.
Mahomes and Lance went to Super Bowl contenders who had the luxury of packaging picks, moving up, and not needing that investment to pay off right away.
With Mahomes specifically, he was put into the exact perfect scenario to thrive. The flashes of “bad Mahomes” that we’ve seen, including last year’s Super Bowl, would be a lot bigger component of his game if not for said perfect scenario.
Point being, the Lions have none of those things. They’re not a perfect scenario for a young QB, and they don’t have the luxury of spending high picks without a fast return on them.
If that is a concern, it simply reinforces that we need to get his replacement into the pipeline. Protecting the ego of our 30M vet QB is not something we should have to worry about. If we are NOT moving on, then we should focus on getting a vet who is better than what we had last year for our backups. Both from a talent standpoint if we need them, but more from a helping Goff dissect defenses perspective.
But do you risk splitting the locker room by putting him in, getting a good play, then Goff makes a mistake and not making him the permanent replacement?
This is Detroit, the backup is always THE guy.
Even if you don’t take him at two, but trade back up to get him, there’s inherent pressure to utilize your asset. Only going to be magnified o those times Goff makes a mistake or has a bad game.
If taken at 2OA, you don’t draft competition for your QB there, you drafted his replacement.
The 49ers gave up a ton to move off JG. He just took the to the NFC Championship game. If you go by the sentiment during the game, Shanahan’s playcalling hurt them, not JGs play.
You’ll get a ton of folks now pointing to the game ending pick. Time to jettison JG. Lance’s time.
Shouldn’t change the entire rest of the game where the fault laid with the coach, not QB. But it will.
Not going to worry about year 4 or 6 because we haven’t started year 2 yet. If they get to year 4 and the only thing holding them back is a QB, push the chips into the middle and go get one, ala the Rams. Goff’s contract will have just ended anyway or in last year. He’s signed for 3 more years I think. Even waiting one more year, he’s still under contract to sit anyone if needed.
Non-Malik Willis reasons I don’t want to draft Malik Willis:
Unlike the Steelers, Commies, Panthers, etc…, we have a QB. I don’t think he’s the long-term answer, but he’s good enough for right now. Also, I could be wrong and he might be the long-term answer and that would be great.
I don’t want to draft a QB we don’t start. I know, I know, Lance, Mahomes, etc… Well those guys are outliers nowadays (and also we don’t even know if Lance is good yet). If you could tell me they’ll hit the ground running in their 2nd years as if they’d played their rookie seasons I’d be all for it, but I have a hunch that’s another outlier. The Chiefs and Niners are great teams with great offensive minds coaching them.
Opportunity cost. I don’t want drafting Willis or any of the other QBs to stop us from taking a better prospect next year. How many QBs have been passed on because a team is waiting on a highly-drafted guy to pan out? The Giants passed on Herbert because of Daniel Jones. The Jags passed on Watson, Mahomes and Lamar Jackson because of Blake Bortles. Tennessee passed on Watson and Mahomes because of Mariota. What a waste that would be.
Malik Willis reasons I don’t want to draft Malik Willis:
The things I believe are important to succeeding at QB in the NFL: timing, accuracy, poise, decision-making, and touch are his weakest areas. Some are worse than others but in general all will need to be improved, some of them drastically.
Continuing from #1, this is unlikely. I know we have this glaring example of it happening recently in Josh Allen, but he is a major, major outlier. And here’s the thing about Allen: he received essentially no high-level coaching before he reached the NFL. He played at a tiny high school, didn’t do the all-star circuit, played at Juco and then Wyoming. In his Wyoming tape his over-striding was comically obvious. Shoring that up has done wonders for his accuracy and touch. Willis played at the largest high school in Georgia, a football powerhouse, Auburn, then under Hugh Freeze. His mechanics are fine, there are no easy tweaks to be made. Now obviously it’s not impossible that he makes the necessary improvements, it’s just that I wouldn’t bet on it with high draft capital.
I think Willis is an example of confirmation bias in action. I say this because I did it, last offseason (Next Years QB Draft Class). I saw all that unteachable stuff and I went googly-eyed. But since I did it last offseason I had the chance to watch him game-by-game this year and at first it was fine but as the season wore on I had to admit to myself he wasn’t the prospect I thought he was. And I watched virtually every one of his games. Can he change/improve? Maybe. But I was hoping he wouldn’t have to.
Yeah dude, like it’s just that easy to go get a Matthew Stafford. More like pushing all your chips for DeShawn Watson, hoping he’ll want to play here (we’re not California) and hoping he keeps his hands off the local talent. Or giving up multiple picks for a reclamation project like Sam Darnold. You cannot look at what the Rams did to get Stafford as something you can just do. Certainly not if you are saying hey come to Detroit… we’re at 9 wins and you are the missing piece!!
Here is the flip side with JG/Lance. They were able to make it to the final 4 teams even though they missed out on what they gave up to get Lance. What they got is a year to groom a raw QB prospect. That part is done. Now will they move JG this season and get the pain that will certainly come with Lance over with? Quite possibly so. But they have a pretty well built team AND their future QB under contract for another 4 seasons and they don’t have to scramble to try to get from the bottom of the first round, to the top. They can just take the best player there and continue to refine the team. If the worst case scenario is that you have to good QB options, well, not a bad problem to have. You just have to pick one then go collect your bean harvest.
