I knew that you would go there. You’ve spent too much virtual time around me.
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Interesting stuff as always from Thats2.
Listened to Nate Tice this morning who had Freeling and Iheanchor as big climbers. He was pretty glowing about the pair of them. Quite like Nate as an evaluator - doesn’t just regurgitate the dominant opinion.
Like Nate, I just think that ultimately tackles are supposed to be a certain shape and move a certain way.
And, this just might be me, but the current draft hierarchy in the trenches - which is the aisle the Lions are likely to be shopping in - is privileging guys who might be maxxed out and might be better college players than they are NFL players.
In a draft such as this - and speaking to the trenches in particular - I’m currently leaning towards players whose best football is ahead of them.
Right, that is sort of the issue with this draft. The best prospects lean toward the developmental side. But will we be in a position to take another developmental player? If Decker’s gone, we really need a guy who will hit the ground running. In a vacuum I prefer to swing on the higher ceiling as well, but for this draft specifically the calculus might be a little different.
I also think “tapped out,” high-floor prospects get punished a little too much, especially at OT. That’s what they said about Decker too. And Fuaga, who the Saints are thrilled with. At that spot, fi they step in and shore up a weakness, they are 100% worth it.
Listened to that pod. I like Nate but sometimes he says stuff that makes zero sense.
Like when he was discussing Ponds and making him a zone CB. Huh? Drafting Ponds and making him a cover two style zone corner would be such a profound waste of his talents.
I also thought Mesidor as a stock down type was weird. The age is an issue for me as well but he’s clearly been a helium guy back half of the year to present. Not OT related but just two reactions I had to that pod.
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I need to listen to that one, I usually like Nate as well but that is a wild Ponds take (though he’s not the only one I’ve heard who isn’t buying the Mesidor hype).
That said for evaluation purposes, I really only zero in on his OL takes. All these pundits have their strengths, and for me that’s where Nate is at his best. All those years listening to his dad, I suspect. He’s pretty good at WR as well.
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Is Dunker going to stay at RT or is he moving inside to Guard.
I’ve seen reports on both
I said this about 50 posts above this one on Dunker (I know it’s sort of lost in the thread at this point):
For me he is 100% a guard.
I admit I am lower on him than most, and I can also admit he’s a very good run blocker. But for as good as he is in the run game, he’s equally as bad in the pass game. Any team that keeps him outside is trying to get their QB killed. His feet are just so heavy, he plays too high, he’s stiff, his footwork is clunky af and he doesn’t seem to be able to gain any distance with his stride. Like his legs just won’t go far enough apart. His hands are all over the place, his chest is exposed too frequently, and his balance is really poor.
I realize he’s a guy who’s easy to like with the ginger mullet and nasty play attitude, but if you’re drafting him to be anything other than a guard, you’re gonna be disappointed imo. And if you’re drafting a guard from Iowa, I’d MUCH rather have Beau Stephens. That guy is gonna be a ten-year starter in the league. I’d rather have Logan Jones too.
And if you want a nasty guy with a dirtbag look, Keylan Rutledge is a better option. He wants to hurt people.
Oooh Rutledge and Ratledge? Sign me up.
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Awfully small jersey for such a big man.
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That Jersey is earmarked for a make a wish kid. New program the NFL started at this year’s draft.
Team Captain! If he’s available. He’s a Lion.
In fairness quite a few of them were captains. Miller, Fano, Tiernan. And there’s a good chance Lomu and Freeling probably would have been if they weren’t so young coming out. All are noted for their leadership.
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The more I look (or glance as compared to lots of y’alls) at the OT prospects currently scattered around #17 and lower in the first round, the less I’m worried about Decker retiring. Nate Tice is my fanboy whisperer, luring me to the mistakes I want to make on April 23…
I agree. I worry we missed our best window and we didn’t take our shot when we had it.
Now we’re entering an offseason with critical needs and the loss of several probowlers last year.
Can Brad pull off some offseason magic and fill all of these holes? I think it’s possible but unlikely. Especially with out a 3rd round pick.
I personally prefer us to look for a LT from a bigger school not one from a small school. Small school LT’s often take much longer to develop.
Francis Mauigoa whom most mock drafts have going to the Lions has played his entire career at RT. Some think he’s best suited as an OG too. I guess people are expecting the Lions to move Sewell to LT and that’s why he’s getting projected to us but I think the Lions prefer to keep Sewell at RT. I just don’t think this is the direction the Lions will go.
Fano seems more likely to me than Mauigoa.
Freeling is a guy us expect us to look hard at. He’s raw but has tremendous upside. He’s a riskier pick than some but I think he’s closer to what the Lions covet in a LT.
Heck I’m not completely convinced we will go OL in round one.
I’d hate to see the Lions pass on a future Probowl player to take an average OL just out of need.
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I don’t really understand the hesitation to move Sewell over. Well, I do I suppose, but I think it’s completely unfounded. Unlike most move candidates (Wirfs), Sewell has extensive high-level experience on the left side, both in college and the pros. The RISKY move was shifting him to the right side in the league, and we saw how he’s adjusted to that. I think he would be a smashing success on the left side.
And for all we know Sewell may want to play LT. If that’s true, I doubt we’d stand in his way.
Mauigoa would be a complete slam dunk for us. Perfect style fit, perfect character fit. The problem is I highly doubt he gets anywhere near us.
Fano is more likely because he’s more likely to fall. But he also might have sub-33 inch arms (one of the reasons he might fall), sticking at tackle isn’t a given. He also doesn’t have the build we have liked in OL under this FO. He’s more lithe and athletic with a narrow base, and is likely to have some anchor issues. No doubt we’ll love the way he plays, but that’s true of all of these guys honestly. It’s a really good class of OTs for guys who fit our mentality.
Freeling is my favorite, but I also expect him to be the biggest riser through the process. I keep seeing him mocked to the Browns at 6 of late, and I think that’s very possible. He’s one of the few traitsy, prototypical guys who put out elite, consistent tape, at least over the last 6 weeks or so.
Oh I think there’s a good chance we don’t. It’s my preference in a vacuum, but for instance I wouldn’t pass on Bain, Reese, Styles or Downs for any of the OTs. I’d only take Mauigoa over McCoy. And that’s just me, Brad will no doubt have his own guys he loves (D’Angelo Ponds WILL be one of them, guaranteed, but most everyone would have you believe 17 is too high for him, I’m not so sure).
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I don’t know when this would have been. I’ve had OTs as my favorite reasonable options for us a lot recently, but none of them fell anywhere near us on draft day. I was a huge Amarius Mims fan, but he went well before everyone thought he would. Most of the OTs did in that loaded class save Guyton, and he’s no better as a prospect than the guys available in this one. High upside guys who might not hit the ground running.
Last year we could have taken Simmons, but no player had ever returned to full health following a torn patellar tendon, I thought KC was taking a HUGE risk, and Brad would have been pilloried for taking the same one. Simmons looked like a smash hit at first, but faded down the stretch (some of it due to off-field issues, granted). I wouldn’t have touched him personally. And Conerly, who was also available, is also similar to the guys available this year.
Paris Johnson in 2023 is about the only high-upside experience guy we passed on, but that would have required taking him at 6 and means we wouldn’t have had two of Gibbs, Campbell, LaPorta or Branch. Hard to fault Brad for that one.
In today’s climate, there are no small school OTs that will be early rounders. They will have all transferred up like Simmons, Guyton, etc…
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Fano is also a RT. And unlike Sewell there is no proof of concept. Sewell has proven he can handle it in the NFL. With Fano you’re relying on 11 starts as a true freshman before he flipped sides. His dominant season (‘24) was at RT.
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I decided to add one more. He’s sort of in a tier of his own but pretty comfortably above the guys below him. I expect some will even have him above Tiernan. I don’t, but he’s not too far below him either. I haven’t ranked it out that far yet, but probably somewhere around 75th overall.
Dametrious Crownover, Texas A&M (~75th overall)
The case for: Pretty much a perfect OT build, 6’6, 331 with just under 36 inch arms at the Senior Bowl. Plays with a hot motor, always moving his feet, one of the better fininshers for a guy this size. Absolutely caves in the DL when down-blocking, really creates movement in the run game. Freakish grip strength and thunderous punches, and while his punches have been far more hit than miss, they are improving. Good balance leads to solid re-anchoring. Despite heavy-footedness on tape, seemed much lighter at the Senior Bowl. Still pretty new to the position, arrived at A&M as a TE and didn’t move into the starting lineup as a T until 2024.
The case against: Technique is inconsistent. Despite improvement hands still get wide too regularly, footwork will abandon him when flustered. Is always fighting against rising pad level. Despite a good showing at the Senior Bowl, he’s heavy footed with poor lateral quickness on tape. Surprisingly middling athlete given TE background. Really, really struggled against the Miami guys in the playoffs. Will have reps than make you sit up and take notice then another that makes you sag and shake your head.
Summary: I expect him to go A LOT higher than he is right now. Somewhere in the 2nd like Belton and Trapilo did last year. But you’re definitely drafting the tools and hoping to mold them. I’ll be honest, he has the tape of a day 3 guy, but he showed enough at the Senior Bowl to make me second-guess it. Looked really explosive coming off the ball. Maybe there’s a better player in there than advertised?
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