Like I said it’s not a death knell to his opportunities here, I just think it might keep him from collecting enough checkmarks in the pros column to push him into the “love” category required of our draft picks.
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Ponds would be my first guess, for sure. We’re going to love him. (Actually this might make for a pretty good topic on its own)
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Both would be true outliers let’s be real…using word salad because we are all good at it lol.
The only pushback I would suggest here is that we just took 2 corners in the 1st and 2nd round in 2024. Our regime has shown to give max opportunity to the guys they’ve drafted. Also signed a pretty high priced corner just last year. One thing that leads me to believe you could be right is what’s going to happen with Terrion?
This pick would send me to the moon!
Ponds is a good shout. Although as JD9 states it would be truly bizarre after their FA.
I think I’d say Iheanachor - appreciate he wouldn’t be that odd. Although I think Nate Tice has him top 12 in the whole draft. And if we accept that Borom has been recruited to not force them to take a tackle, we can also surmise that Borom gives them some space to take a developing tackle whose ceiling is higher than Miller’s perhaps. Opting out of his bowl game isn’t a good look - but players who have travelled across the world also suggests a certain level of fortitude and ‘grit’.
The other thoughts are edge rusher and I’m inclined to say Malachi Lawrence just on the basis of Ollie and Jon’s analysis! We certainly look lite across the d-line at the moment. And I can see Brad piling in on one side of the trenches. He does tend to try to pile resources into one particular problem. And his Rams background might suggest that the defensive line is more of a priority.
They would be, for sure. But at least in Borom’s case the example exists. Eleumunor for instance, Morgan Moses flamed out a few times before catching on, Andrew Wylie, Van Lanen, Jaylon Moore, etc… No, not great, but serviceable. Like I said, if he has to play for us and does exactly what he did last year for Miami, we’d be fine.
But I can’t think of a single example of an OL showing promise as a rookie, then struggling for 3 years (with his last one being his worst, to the point of getting benched), then going on to hit. Especially if they were drafted on days 1 or 2. Some depth guys took a while to work their way into lineups (like Mays or Aaron Brewer), but guys with more capital have had more opportunities. Can you think of anyone? I’m racking my brain and I honestly can’t.
So while both are outliers, true, one rarely hits, while the other almost never hits. Which to me is pretty much moot anyway because unlike Borom, I think Scruggs was brought in as little more than roster fodder. An opportunity to get a look at a guy they liked pre-draft for peanuts.
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I mean that’s a super specific set of circumstances you are setting here. I will try to think of some though.
Not many apply to begin with but a ton apply (like Borom) just due to the volume on day 3 and in UDFA
Well I am of the belief that you can never have enough CBs, if I was GM I would definitely drive the fan base crazy with how often I drafted them. They’re just so important, you have to use so many of them, and you go through them so quickly via roster churn and injuries. We might not need one this second, but we will again, much sooner than you think.
Perhaps as quickly as this offseason if Terrion gets in trouble, but even if not quite that quickly, soon thereafter.
I also think most people underrate 1) that we view the draft as a talent-adding exercise, not a need-filling exercise (as it should be), and 2) that the #1 thing a player must have to become a Detroit Lion is for our FO to fall in love with you. This to me is why you see some out-of-left-field picks like @JessC mentioned in his original message… Brad fell in love.
And Ponds is gonna be sooooo us. He’s like a smaller version of Witherspoon (@Davicus), and everyone knows we loved Witherspoon. Of course so did the rest of the league, so I have a hunch he’s going higher than we think.
Ha, I would hope you’re right! He’d be one of I was the GM for sure. But if we’re predicting, he generally isn’t the type of edge we ‘fall’ for. That would be more like Parker or Young, though like you I’d much rather have Lawrence.
Mostly just an OL who got plenty of run over his rookie contract and got appreciably worse, then going on to hit later. It doesn’t have to end with him getting benched or anything.
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Haha. So I’m guessing you’d rather have Lawrence and then Tiernan above Miller and then Jacas? When the latter is more likely given our recent past preferences.
What if Maui fell to 7 like Sewell did for us…
Hmm… that is actually close because I’m quite a bit higher on Miller than Tiernan for us specifically, and the latter would have to shift to RT, which might have some growing pains. Unlike Freeling, I think Tiernan’s long-term position is RT only, but he’s never played it. So it’s perhaps less hit-the-ground-running than you’d expect, despite his experience. Whereas Miller is plug and play there. You could also maybe leave Sewell at RT and start Tiernan at LT for a while, but like I said, I don’t think he can hold up there in the league long-term. For me it would be better to take your medicine right away.
I’m also quite a bit higher on Jacas than the other edge rushers available in that area. If you’d said DDS or Mesidor or Moore the decision would have been easy lol.
There definitely comes a point where a trade-up for Mauigoa becomes my favorite option. He’s the perfect combo of need and value, he’s an ass-kicker galore, and even IF he can’t hold up at RT (and I think he can), I have him graded as an all-time OG prospect. Like on the Quenton Nelson/Zack Martin level. You’d be hard-pressed to find a better option for us.
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Great point.
We tend to not think about who Brad will draft because he sees the draft different than most of us casual fans. He picks the best player available. While most of us pick the best player that fills a need. So we didn’t look at RBs and LBs like Jahmyr and Jack.
We’re already assuming that we’ll either take a T or EDGE. And that’s because we wanna fill need. I am usually good at predicting once the Lions are on the clock. That’s only because I rate players differently.
I don’t know Brad’s criteria for picking a guy. These are the traits that I pick below:
- Physical ability (speed, agility, size-depending on position)
- Football intelligence
- Injury history
- Position of need
- Leadership
- Ability in stressful situations
Brad may have a different order of/or preference. He’s often told the media what he looks for. But, he doesn’t discuss the order of priority.
I look forward to figuring his priorities out.
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IMO the #1 quality a guy has to have is that Brad has to have fallen in love with you. And we’ve gotten a pretty good idea over the past few years of the things that makes him fall in love. That’s why I think Ponds will be an option. I KNOW he’s gonna love him. Enough to make him our pick over others? Well I can’t say that for certain, but I’m fairly certain he’ll be in a bucket of guys we like.
Yep, he treats the draft like a talent-adding exercise, not a need-filling exercise. As he should.
Haha! That’s a total fudge! No worries.
It might just be the voices I’m listening to and it might just be that I want to upset the Borom sceptics …
But I am starting to think that maybe Brad thinks that one elite tackle in Penei is enough. Maybe he thinks that he’s invested enough in the offensive line with Manu, Ratledge, Mays, Frazier and Borom. Other contenders invest far less and do better.
Maybe he’s just going to pile in on the D-line?!
While I don’t agree that he should. I do think he should enhance or broaden his approach. I’m glad you have kind of figured him out.
Who do you think he will fall in love with this upcoming draft?
Maybe I should move this to another thread. This really is about Roger McCreary. He’s a good player. I would’ve gotten a S. And if BB is back, he can go back to NB. But we’ll see.
Well I can give you guys I’m pretty sure will be in the bucket of guys I think we’ll love, but it won’t be complete. I just don’t have enough information on some of these guys to know (Tyleik was like that). But we really value a love of the game, character, leadership, competitiveness, work ethic and football intelligence really highly.
So for instance Ponds is a chirpy captain who worked his way into a legit prospect, plays like his hair is on fire, flies into tackles, reads route concepts before they break showing his smarts, a guy the defense rallies around, etc… He will 100% be our type.
Blake Miller is like that too. Their season went off the rails yet he was the only highly-ranked Clemson prospect to play in their bowl game. Remember Brad and Dan mentioning how much they loved that about LaPorta and Jack? Miller didn’t miss a game in four years and only missed one practice. He plays OL with evil intent and is rarely fooled by any stunts, blitzes, etc… I worry some about his core strength, but that’s more of an evaluation issue.
Others I think will check all of our intangible/play style boxes: Bain, Mauigoa, Styles, Downs, Freeling, Delane, Faulk, Abney, Thieneman, CJ Allen, Ioane, Kyle Louis, Reese, Rodriguez, Stukes, Keionte Scott, TJ Parker, Hecht, Bisontis, Lemon, Lew, Zion Young (despite the DUI), Gabe Jacas, Tiernan, Dani Dennis-Sutton, Rutledge, Dunker, Kage Casey, Zuhn, JC Davis, Aamil Wagner, Roush, Joly, Aiden Fisher, Haulcy, Bud Clark, Taafe, Chandler Rives, etc… (I’m sure I’m missing some)
All are captains and/or noted leaders, play with hot motors and are noted for their work ethics, and generally fit stylistically with the way we employ their positions.
I also have a pretty good idea of guys we won’t be into. Anyone who mails it in (Woods) or doesn’t compete (McCoy, sadly) or takes plays off (Brazzell, Bailey), guys who don’t fit our prototypes (R. Mason Thomas, Mesidor, Howell, maybe Fano - see below).
That leaves a lot of guys not on either list, and for those guys I just don’t know.
The one guy who I’m not sure about is Fano. He checks every intangible box and most of our play style boxes too, but he’s a pretty lithe guy with thin shoulders and hips (and sometimes it shows), and I don’t know that he can reliably get much thicker. Typically that’s not the type of OL we go for, but if the idea is to move him to center and get him some help? Maybe? Seems like the sort of thing we wouldn’t do in the 1st though, and that’s what it would take.
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https://x.com/detroitonlion/status/2033127180272800144?s=46
Quite the stretch. Too bad it was entirely just luck and not actual quality OT play.
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Hey I was just about to post this. We should probably move this Borom discussion to the Borom thread lol, but eh, it’s petering out anyway.
You see that above stat @Jman? If we had to play him and got production like that, we’d be just fine. Except no one would notice, because when an OL is doing his job right, nobody notices. And mostly nobody cares.
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