That wasn’t the effective tax rate. After deductions it was like 45%. The corporate tax rate is the bigger change. Personally I think they need to be higher but as @HiFidelity has more or less suggested you have to be careful not to overshoot, tank growth and actually diminish receipts while attempting to increase them. I’m not a radical. I’m interested in compromise here. For instance I both think it’s true that we may need more efficient entitlement spending AND that the poorest Americans may not be taken care of as well as they should be. This is a complicated situation that we find ourselves in. Compromise will be imperative. But I simply don’t agree that any form of progressive taxation or wealth redistribution should be a no go. If you do that is fine. I respect your right to feel that way.
“Usually”? In general this statement is kind of ick. Is that the reason for some? Sure. But you’re painting with a broad brush here.
was just going to say this. before all the electronic BS, my father worked for Buick, on his income alone, He had a house, a shed full of tools and machinery, Harley’s plural, cars , trucks, tractors, umteen guns, boats, pontoons, any damn thing HE wanted to buy, and STILL had spending cash. nooo problem, he could travel all over hunting and fishing, whatever the hell HE saw fit.
TODAY, each person has to have several jobs to make ends meet, you got to work as a TEAM together , or else. UNLESS you happen to fall into a VERY lucrative job. There is no “middle class” you either have money or you don’t , and our rights have been trampled on. you know WHY Our Government “allowed us to have the Internet, our own cell phones, tablets, laptops and video games, the ability to watch 20 million movies at a push of a button? To: “dumb us down” , To make America bury their heads in those things , while they sat around thinking up new ways of ■■■■■■■ us over, and as a Nation , we glommed onto all the new electronic/ smart shit and said “okay” like Buckwheat. We got suckered in ! We used to be a powerful Nation, full of wise, hardworking, strong, connected beings, far more connected. And we the people “used to be” far more fit, healthy, well-armed, country that would stand -side by side IF war broke out here in America, in our back yards and that. I think The Government sat around and thought “What if we really angered The citizens?” “Man think how strong they are!” SO, they decided to dumb us down, put things in our food, drinks, medications and hide it, give them all these electronics so they sit around becmming dependant on them, while getting slower, fatter, lazier, sicker more quickly” then we can control them far more easier if we ever had Civil war again." I’ll go further, IF we had any idea what they have done to people as a whole, done to our foods, beverages, and medications-WTF The FDA has done, we would already be in a war with Our Government.
except history doesn’t agree with you. economics say that yes prices do go up but not the drastic ridiculous amount like YOUR WHOPPER WILL BE $10. well minimum wage didn’t go up but the whopper is $10.
When covid hit and supply and demand went coocoo nutso, prices took off. but then economists realized that 40-50% of the inflation on prices was caused by profit taking. Pure theft in the guise of covid. Look at new cars. a 10-20 thousand dollar ‘market adjustment’ when they had inferred no additional costs, especially to stuff that was already sitting on the lot.
California did a $20 minimum wage increase for fast food workers and prices went up 1.5-3.5% for the consumer. the horror.
as to the 90% tax rate on the wealthiest (not the normal person, just the rich beyond rich) the country exploded. infrastructure went nuts. the middle class was born and THRIVED.
now, lets look at the trickle down theory of the 1980s. the thought being the rich would pee down their scraps on everyone. problem is it doesn’t work that way. they take those additional gains and put them away, hide them, etc. you can follow economic charts showing the departure of the wealthiest to everyone else. growth up until that point was parallel with the wealthy and everyone else. after the 80s, the gap went nuts.
it’s just data. giving the rich everything they want has never worked for the normal person, throughout history.
you absolutely cannot trust corporations or the wealthiest to ‘do the right thing’. they will do whatever they can to increase their profits. hence the call for massive deregulation as well. the reason they used child labor back in the day is because they could. was it wrong? absolutely. Corporations have no morals.
Hey now you’re going to hurt corporations feelings because they’re people too or at least that’s what Citizens United says….
Worst damn Supreme Court decision in the last 50 years Grumble grumble old angry guy shakes fist at clouds insert Meme here
@Sheepish asking the government to collect and allocate our earned money is literally the exact same thing as trickle down economics. It’s just from a different bucket, just less controllable ironically.
@CuriousHusker the purpose of tax deductions is for the government to exert control on the market. As my tax person says, this is something the government wants. Want someone to open a farm? Give a farm tax credit. Invest in solar? Same thing. I am actually a fair tax proponent, but I get that the government wants to macro-economically make decisions to benefit Americans. In the 50’s those tax breaks support home buying, defense, investing, lending, and philanthropy.
Things have changed so much. Regardless of class, people want to be able to do anything they see online. It’s in their face 24-7 not to be happy with what they have, or what they can work for.
My solution is jobs. Get people jobs and the ability to vertically ascend. Infrastructure, construction, communications.
Hey this is a cool topic all. Thanks for keeping it civil. I am learning a lot.
We are probably under the Laffer curve today but we were definitely over it prior to the Reagan tax cuts. Government receipts have 10X’d in real terms 1950 - 2026 while population has only increased ~ 2.3X. I don’t know that maximizing government receipts should be a goal but if it is we are already close.
I have a hard time agreeing that this is a taxing problem but rather a spending problem. If corporate efficiencies were applied to government I would guess that as much of a quarter of our spending would be unlocked to fund … well, everything
and to head you off @CuriousHusker this isn’t an argument for less taxation or personal greed on my part (you previously imputed this). This is a policy and economics discussion.
I struggle with court decisions that may be “correct” but cause so much harm that the finding shouldn’t have been made.
Yes and no. more on no imo. giving a responsible government, tasked with improving the country and growing the wealth of ALL of the populace tax money is a good thing. Remember, your taxes are to make your life better for you, all around. infrastructure, safe food and water, a competent defense mechanism for both foreign and domestic bad actors. there is a certain amount of trust you have to place in them, but the era I’m talking about was pretty damn trustworthy. Eisenhower was literally a good dude who realized out of control military spending was a detriment to the majority of the people of the US in missing what they could have spent it on. very famous quote he gave too. not to mention his farewell address. Giving massive tax cuts to the wealthiest and corporations trusting them to do the right thing with it isn’t the way it’d work. and has been proven thus. there was a tax break for corporations, if they took their profits and invested it within the company either in the infrastructure or pay raises/bonuses they’d get a tax break. That was removed. Now it’s all stock buybacks. That does work for a portion of the employees but it’s also really volatile and can backfire. I think I’d rather have an actual raise. The data proves that those tax cuts have done more harm to the middle and lower classes. infrastructure is in terrible shape in a lot of areas because now you have to catch up from the lack of work being done for decades because of lack of funds.
I do agree spending is the issue, not in amount but where it is being spent. There was a huge impetus to cut ‘inefficient’ government last year with doge. what it found out, by their own admission, is that government itself is pretty efficient. doge cost more than it saved, by far. it also generated massive security risks for the country and it’s populace both in cyber security and social security itself. And lets not forget taking the national debt and just …well…exploding it for no good reason. when the debt went up with covid, THAT is what the debt is for. emergencies. not tax breaks and handouts.
The fact that the wealthiest are making more money by percentage than they ever have, and disgustingly so, and then complaining about raises taxes on them by $1 should tell you they know how good they have it now.
Yuuup.
Big govt IS big business.
91% wasn’t the effective rate. It was mid forties. Higher than today but not a lot higher. The corporate tax rate was however.
Overwhelmingly transfer payments/entitlements, right?
I very much appreciate the conversation and your wisdom. In certain ways we’re not that far off.
My personal experience with offseason customers who are on the lower part of the K of the K shaped economy has alarmed me. Conversely the high season customer base, who are in the top 10-15% of the economy, are spending money like never before. I know that exists for other innkeepers/hoteliers in my circle as well. It may be a travel and leisure thing, or more pronounced in the sector at least, bc generally speaking it’s a service that you don’t have to spend on. But anecdotally it feels to me like Joe Six pack is under the greatest financial strain that he has been in the fifteen years that I have been doing this.
I would like to see that addressed but I am open minded as to how we attempt to do it.
we have allowed it to be so. hey lets let business leaders run things. lets put business leaders in governmental positions that apply to their business.
about the last business leader I liked that ran for a government position was ross perot. he was pretty darn accurate about a lot of stuff.
Great post
I agree something is broken out that way
Also, I’ve never thought of the conditioning psyche that home ownership is you’ve made it.
Interesting.
For someone who has done both…
Renting and not having any problems to fix is an underrated life choice for happiness
Also, renting and investing the difference is the way to go financially the way the markets have gone in my lifetime
It may be a certain demographic that things that way. Of my fourteen employees only one has a bachelors degree. A few went to culinary school, beauty school, a bit of CC, etc. Very few of them grew up in stable homes. So I think it’s rational that the stability that home ownership stands would be validation that they did well for themselves.
I kind of agree with the maintenance part of it. it BLOWS at times. but if you have shitty landlords you could be in for a pain. also rent prices are supreme nuts right now for no real good reason.
And we are done here. Unless you move back to Teddy. Ike gets a mostly pass but he inherited the easiest road in the history of history.
Let’s check M2 and correlate…
Hey, what was the OasdI tax back then(both sides)? And property? And city? And sales? Getting crowded from all sides.
Me 2. Swoon.