Trade Back with Arizona

One guy who has good intel around draft time is Peter Schrager. He has mentioned and mocked the Cardinals trading up for an Alabama receiver. He seems to have a pretty good feel for Arizona’s tendencies. I looked at his final mock draft for the last 3 years and here is what he projected for the Cardinals:

2018-Trade up to 10 and draft Josh Rosen :white_check_mark:
2019-Kyler at #1✅
2020-Isaiah Simmons at 8✅
2021-trade up to 7 for Waddle :question:

He seems to have a pretty good read on Steve Keim and may know something. I truly am starting to believe that Arizona may move up for Waddle. I would assume we get a 2 this year and a 2 or a 1 next year. Maybe we grab Darrisaw at 16?

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I would totally move back to 16, get a 2 and a 1 next year, and take Kadarius Toney. I don’t want a Christian Darrisaw or someone like that that screams “average to above average” like that. Most of the 13-24ish range does that for me.

Now, I wouldn’t pass up on Sewell or Smith to do it.

#16 would be an excellent sweet spot range for Parsons…Big gamble, he would be available at #16. If so, it would be a Home Run for Holmes, and provide a crucial 2nd Rounder in 2021, along with an assumed 2022 1st Rounder. Could happen…

Am still hoping for Sewell/Slater at #7, either would be transformational for the Offense ST & LT for all kinds of reasons already highlighted in earlier posts. Not sexy. Not even the most urgent need, but smart drafting, regardless. Get the WR at #41 or trade down in the 2nd to net an extra 3rd, and go WR shopping then…So many options…

I’m not sure I’m up to going that far down. The top tier players would seem to be gone at this point. There is a group of players at the top that I think we should be in a position to draft. I’m not sure you get any of them at 16. I don’t think you will get a 2nd this year and a 1st and 2nd next year. The trade chart has moving back to 15 as a mid 2nd round pick. The only time I see a team selling the farm to move up is for a QB and Arizona has theirs. I’m not sure missing out on one of the top tier guys is worth a 2nd.

These are the players I don’t want to miss out on:

WR - Chase, Waddle, Pitts (yes, I see Pitts as a Jumbo WR that gives an immense amount of flexibility. I think Smith is just too small to excel in the NFL. Maybe at 16?

OL - Sewell and Slater. Darrisaw just doesn’t have enough experience as a pass blocker and trading back for just a 2nd when Slater and/or Sewell are still there just doesn’t make sense.

CB - Patrick Surtain. Always use great CB’s.

One of those 6 will be there. If one of the QB’s are there, then I’m sure you can get a nice haul in a trade back. I assume that 4 QB’s will be gone by the time my 6 players are drafted (probably before our pick) or we are trading back with a team that wants a QB.

Parsons is an interesting player for me. If there’s a player that excels at all 3 phases of LB play (run stopping, pass rush and coverage), they are very much so worth a high draft pick to do so. I’m just not sure Parsons is good enough in coverage to warrant being a top 10 pick. Can he chase in coverage? Absolutely! I’m just not positive that he has the instincts to play combo or zone coverage or has the ball skills to be an elite pass defender at the position. If you are taking an off the ball LB in the top 10 (or trading away to choose one of the elite players in the draft) than you need to be elite in all three phases). If the Lions scouts think he has the ability to learn quickly, than a player like him is worth either taking high or trading back to pick him up.

But Parsons also has off the field question marks (more than 1) that need to be sorted through. I honestly don’t know his level of involvement of the hazing incident at PSU, but he did nothing to stop it nor did he get the coaching staff involved. As a team leader, that’s unacceptable. As a long time coach, any leadership position would have been stripped if that were my team. Again, the people making the decision for the Lions would have to make sure he wouldn’t cause any issues for us. Rueben Foster is a great example of dumbassery from a guy that could have it all, but threw it away. That’s two issues Parsons has to overcome to be considered a top 10 pick.

If Arizona gave us 2 seconds and a first, then yea, I would make the trade. I just don’t see them willing to go that much for Waddle.

I think the trade would more likely take the form of Nos. 16 & 49, plus a 2022 3rd Rd pick.

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How far back could we trade, and potentially pick up Slater?
Could it be possible to get a 2nd rounder in that traceback?
Add some sneakiness and big play ability, along with a whole lot of ugliness.
Give us the ability to kick their ass in the fist fight, as well as break their will with big play ability.

I want an offense that can punch you in the face, and still strike deep.

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If it’s only a 3rd next year then I’d push for another pick THIS year, or two like the 6th and 7th.

@FreebirdPartDeux what do you think they’d say if we asked straight up 7 for 16 and their 2022 1st? That’s a deal I’d be ok with. I want 3 1sts next year.

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Arizona really doesn’t have much draft capital to trade up. They have no 3rd or 4th Rd picks this year. They’ve got a 5th Rd pick, No. 160 overall, but after that just a bunch of late picks 223, 243, and 247.

To move up, the Cards are probably going to have to trade a 2022 pick.

On the old JJ chart, 16 & 49 equate to 1410 pts vs 1500 for No. 7 overall. A 2022 3rd Rd pick (no matter where it is), covers the difference.

On the Rich Hill chart, Nos. 16 & 49 equate to 423 pts vs 426 pts for No. 7.

Then take the 223 and 243, we need all the picks we can get this year AND there will be some WR’s who fall.

Given that CAR/DAL/LAC, ALL, have high OT needs, assuming Sewell is drafted at #5 CIN, there is only 1 Premium OT left, i.e. Slater. IMO, Slater is as good as gone by #13 LAC, if not beforehand. Heck, CAR #8 & DAL #!0 are so close to DET #7, I don’t envision either offering a Big enough, realistic trade package to entice the Lions to go into another direction, assuming OT is Holmes biggest desire to help Goff.

Of course, Chase/Waddle/Smith are tempting. In summary, there are 2 legitimate OT’s in this draft occupying the Top Tier Sewell/Slater. Subsequent tiers are simply demonstrably Lower. What’s your comfort factor, each GM has to ask himself, if you have the opportunity to draft either Sewell or Slater and you abstain?..OTs are foundational chess pieces in any offense. Why risk it?

My hope for any trade down is to dallas at 10 for a 3rd this year and 2nd next year. We should still get elite guy at 10 and then a solid player in 3rd. The 2 next year gives us more flexibility and ability to fill holes this staff feels we have after a season in their systems

Unless I am raping you, I don’t want to move past 9


Weasel… just curious cuz I like the way you usually think…if 3 QBs, sewell, Pitts, chase gone, who are the next couple you’d want?

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The Jeffrey Epstein approach to GM’ing

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2 Minutes - Unsportsmanlike Conduct.

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At that scenario it’s how far you can trade down. If 8 or 9 are offered, I’d probably take them, then take Smith. Free Beenz eh?

If they aren’t I still take Smith. Yes, he’s skinny. So was David Bowie and he turned out fine…weird AF, but fine.

If the Lions really want Parsons over a WR, they can probably back up to 12 and get him. 15 It would be a question, and a risk I don’t want to take, and beyond 15 I am not interested at all regardless.

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I’m not certain Parsons is still there at 15. Not sure why a lot of people on this board think he will be.

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