An what does Raymond give over Cephus who you say is redundant?
We have others who can return. You forget Cephus was are best WR at the time when he got hurt. He is a hard cover an has strong hands. He is a night mare to cover out of the slot.
Brown can switch he is not just a slot WR. I like Cephus way more than Raymond. We need guys who can beat one on one since either Chark or Williams will need help maybe both thats why Brown a Cephus an Swift an Hock will create problems Reynods also will be problem.
I like McKinley as the number 6 WR over Raymond. There are couple of UDFA also who return. I would keep Raymond as #6 I like his ST play.
I also think this. I was simply saying if there is a decision between the two, I hope Cephus is chosen over Raymond.
Raymond is not a good returner btw. 21 PRs (~1.2 per game) doesn’t make someone a good return man. He has never scored on a return, and has had 77 career PR opportunities (also 53 KRs without a score). Career averages of 9.1 per punt return and 20.5 per kick return, both are not good or nothing special. He is not a threat as a return man. He is simply, we have nobody better type of guy.
That’s all I’m going to say as this topic has gotten me into trouble before
The reason he had so few returns is because our defense sucked and rarely forced punts. Raymond averaged 11.2 yards per return last year. That was top 5 in the NFL. It’s not his fault he only had 21 returns.
My point was sample size. 21 returns is not a legitimate sample to call someone good at something. 77 returns is a larger sample. It’s a much better indication of what kind of returner he is. Add in 53 KR opportunities and he has 130 career returns and zero scores. With averages of 9.1/20.5…neither indicate a good return man. He is as blah as it gets as returner.
Fair points about previous years stats. I honestly never watched him play before last season, where he was decent as a punt returner. He also had almost 600 yards receiving last year. He will make the team. He’s got 2.75 mill guaranteed next year. Holmes was on record saying he wanted him back.
I know I was not happy with a WR spot basically guaranteed to him. Especially because I was really hoping to add a couple of good WRs, which we did. It feels like their is no opening in the top 6 because he’s guaranteed a spot. Which for me, he isn’t a player who should be guaranteed anything. Only way a WR makes this team out of camp now is if Jamo starts the year on pup.
Not liking our WR6 is a problem I can handle though haha
Haha this year’s WR6 was in the starting lineup most of last year, so it’s a huge improvement. Hopefully he strictly plays special teams because that means the other WR’s are staying healthy. Chark, J-Mo and Cephus are all coming back from season ending injuries, so that is a bit of concern.
Cephus is slow and can not play special teams. The lions have shown that when you are lower in the depth chart you have to have versatility. Cephus is very much on the bubble, so is Raymond….but Raymond has more going for him due to his speed, special teams value, locker room grinder and the staff loves his team first attitude.
I really don’t think so, Goff had a real connection with Cephus early last season. I see them taking it real slow with J-Mo! And we will start the season with Chark, St. Brown, Reynolds, Cephus and Raymond as the 5 deep WR chart, with J-Mo on PUP.
In week 6 or 7, they will have a decision to make. Activate J-Mo and keep 6 WR’s or possibly cut someone. But, by week 6 or 7, who knows the health of the roster.
we have no idea what they do with JW and all the information out there is you want to base any speculation on intel out there is saying he will be good to go for training camp.
back to my original point, the lions desire versatility on their low depth guys…that’s how they stick around……as of right now he doesn’t offer anything other then wr reps. Cephus is very low on the totem poll. You are talking about the 5-6 wr at best with a healthy unit.
All I’m saying when TC roles around and you keep reading reports of him being on the bubble this is the reason why….it shouldn’t come as a surprise if and when he is cut or traded for a 6th round pick……
I agree. I don’t think Raymond is better, just think he is more versatile. It’s something I noticed last year and was confirmed by a few others and if you ever are trying to guess who makes the roster etc w the lower tier guys look at their versatility. They are more likely to stick the more diversified their contribution is.
Just as an exercise, let’s examine the market for Raymond. Typically you’re only going to see a draft pick trade for a player, at this time of year, if they meet a certain criteria.
You’re uncertain you’re going to be able to woo them as a free agent when multiple teams are competing for their services.
Their skills completely fit into your scheme and fills a deficiency of that type of talent.
You have suffered a disastrous injury at that skillset.
The talent level is fantastic in comparison to the contract.
Now, I haven’t examined Denver’s particular situation, but I do find it questionable that a 5th round pick would be up for grabs in this situation. Yes, I get it, Trinity Benson, our own personal Newman.
I just don’t see Denver reversing the circumstances. Always worth a shot though.
It might come down to how you interpret “on the bubble”. Like, I wouldn’t phrase that way, but I agree with everything QBH is saying. He’s prone if someone has a really good showing by virtue of him being WR5 or WR6.
I consider a bubble guy someone who’s like the 53rd player, but that might be too narrow a definition.
