Its funny because @HSVLion, myself and a few others have called out the Fields detractors a few months back during the aftermath of the National Championship game. It just seems to me that Fields is somehow being singled out and none of the criticisms or question thrown his way seems to be applicable to any other QB prospect but him. I agree it must be salty Michigan fans because I seriously can’t think of any other reason… 
It’s 100% true but I digress. I’m not sure why you all want to deny the true and actual facts here. This is pretty common knowledge stuff guys.
Not true…
Not even remotely true.
The OSU offense is very simplified offense for the QB. It asks far less of its QB than a pro style or traditional spread style offense. It doesn’t ask them to read defenses. They use a quick strike one read offense by design.
This is common knowledge stuff here… But here’s a link for you where you can actually take the time to learn thier offense if you want to.
From that tutorial.
The Buckeye offense isn’t overly complicated as they use very few schemes and concepts to dominate opposing defenses.
See how Ohio State is able to simplify their schemes while appearing complex
with a variety of quick-strike offensive strategies
This last quote is the most important one. They utilize a one read quick strike passing game. This is what I’m talking about. They do not ask the QB to read the defense and adjust pre-snap. They do not use complicated concepts or schemes. They do not use many pro style concepts in their passing game… however their run game concepts are a different story. They use more complicated stuff their.
This is why you see so many articles out there talking about him being a one read QB and articles by people trying to prove he’s not one. This talk stems from the style of offense he is in.
For some reason you all think I’m being anti Fields. Which I am not… in just pointing out why he’s not a 1OA QB and why he would be held in higher regard if he came from a different school running a more complex offense.
These are the concerns with him. These are the reasons I’d like to see him land on a team where he can ride the pine a year behind a veteran QB.
His physical attributes are impressive and he has the tools to be a successful QB but I think he’s more boom or bust for these reasons.
Ok, since I can’t go and literally find the video clips of Daniel Jeremiah, Joel Klatt, and others disagreeing with this, I won’t attempt to use that as a “citation” because it’s not “valid” even though that’s exactly where I’m getting this from. So I guess I have to give you this, although I disagree with it having seen sources that I cannot directly cite. If you want to go find them yourself somewhere, go watch the full pro day tape, and the Northwestern game directly after the 2nd INT to see what I’m talking about. It does exist.
Also, explain the 5 progression reads shown against Clemson if it doesn’t exist in the offense?
One thing you didn’t mention was anything about my comments about Sark and his “no read” offense. In this thread, you called Alabama a school where successful QBs have come from historically. There’s another one coming out this year in Mac Jones. He didn’t have to read a single coverage this year, and I have evidence I can cite for you about this if you want me to. If you can’t admit that you also think this is a problem for Jones, than this is just more of the anti-Fields talk.
Oh, and thanks for that link by the way. I’ll be using that.
I think what’s really going on is people aren’t listening to what is said and are jumping to conclusions. You’ve made a lot of false assumptions, conclusions and accusations on my posts and in this thread.
Take a step back and actually try to listen. Have an honest discussion. It’s more fun for everyone that way.
Please listen for a second … last year I pointed out why Okudah wasn’t worthy of a 3OA pick. Everyone called me an Okudah hater and an OSU hater even though I repeatedly said that I liked Okudah. I pointed out his flaws and why he would have rookie struggles. Everything I said came true. I still think Okudah can be a successful NFL CB though. I still like Okudah as a prospect but he wasn’t worthy of a 3OA pick.
I’m doing the same thing here with Fields. I’m pointing out his flaws and why he’s not a 1OA QB. Why he’s best suited to ride the pine a year. Why he’s more boom or bust. I actually like Fields but I recognize him for what he is. You assume I don’t like him, and that I’m a salty Michigan fan … lol … which neither is true.
Please stop making assumptions and actually listen.
Look at P. Mahomes for an example … why do you think P. Mahomes was drafted at 10AO?
Mahomes was 16-21 as a starter. He showed accuracy but inconsistency to. (Sound familiar) He had some flaws in his mechanics and footwork. But he also came from a spread offense that utilized a lot of quick strike throws too. He also hadn’t taken many snaps under center. Needless to say the athleticism was their but so were plenty of concerns… had he landed on a team like the NYJ I think he might have busted out. Lucky for him he landed in KC with a good QB mind who understood how to get the most out of him. They sat him a year and worked on the things he needed to work on.
Fields has a lot of similarities… he has that kind of upside but if he lands in the wrong situation he could just as easily fail too. I think his best chances are to land on a team who can sit him a year and let him learn behind a veteran. I like him in SF and ATL. I don’t like him in CAR or DEN
That’s not accurate and I’m sure your miss understanding what was said. If you want to you can provide your proof and we can discuss Mac Jones and Alabama’s offense.
But Steve Sarkisian’s offenses uses a concept of a progression passing game where the emphasis is on reading progressions post snap as opposed to reading defenses pre snap. The QB has reads and progressions though. This is very much different from what OSU does … Alabama utilized a lot of pro style concepts. This is one of them… However Nick Saban has talked many times about how Mac Jones has improved on his reads.
But … what your doing here is trying to justify Fields concerns by pointing out concerns for another QB. Mac Jones has plenty of concerns too. I think this board over values Fields and under values Jones though.
They make some reads, but you said something about reading coverages somewhere. If you didn’t then my bad, I didn’t go check. You’re right about this, that Alabama is progression football versus checking based off coverage. Sark is the king of letting the play run based off of what you’re doing, but he does it post snap so you can’t adjust.
Here’s him saying all of this…
Alabama makes way more post snap reads of the defense than OSU does. They read players and safety alignment and can check based on that. I’m not going to argue that. Both teams don’t read coverages though. People in general, and I’m not going to say you to either single you out or claim you’ve said this, need to hold Mac to the standard they have Fields at that “well he sucks because he can’t read coverages.” I know you didn’t say that Air, you said that he’ll have a bigger learning curve and that if he sits and learns NFL offense that he has a lot of potential. Other people have said that though.
So here is Sark literally saying that he has never asked his QB to read coverage before. I haven’t once heard that as a con to Mac Jones like I have for Fields. Sorry I wanted to get that off my chest.
So I guess my point is that you can’t possibly have watched Fields’s film and not seen him go through a progression first. You basically said and agreed with every other point I was going to make.
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Historically… the “pro style” offenses did have a better success rate of producing QBs.
But how about guys drafted in the last decade?
The only problem is that fewer and fewer college teams actually utilize a pro style system.
And… more NFL teams are incorporating college spread concepts as well, which is why there has been plenty of discussion about how most teams are in nickel personnel on defense for the majority of snaps in the current NFL.
As @HSVLion pointed out… Alabama does not even run a “pro style” offense any longer.
I also want point out that I was not just referring to the “scheme”… but also the college.
This was actually more of the main point I was making because some have questioned Ohio Sate QBs. Texas Tech and Wyoming have produced 2 of the best young QBs in the NFL.
I think that an argument could be made that technology advances allowing more information to be shared and digested by players, coaches, and scouts has been a factor in more QBs coming from schools that are not “traditional” powerhouses.
And… the 3 schools that have produced the most high round picks at QB in recent years are Clemson, Alabama, and Oklahoma. Although they are major programs, none of them run a “pro-style” offense any longer.
I was emphasizing a combo of the 2 points… because it is getting more rare to find power 5 teams running “pro style” offenses.
Yea it still holds true for both QB and OL.
True also … the spread offense and RPO systems have taken college programs by storm. There’s still a lot of pro style offenses and concepts still used however. This trend is the biggest reason why so many OL and QB’s struggle to make the jump to the NFL.
The rest of your post is getting way outside the discussion and point that was asked and made though.
Is that what were doing? Having an honest discussion?
I believe your issue is Ohio State.
I went around with you on Okudah. Our disagreement last year was about his speed. Not Ohio State stuff. Here I think its a different argument you are making.
Going to Ohio State is not a flaw. Unless you are a Michigan fan, of course.
You don’t think we’ll sit him and let him develop? The Lions have thrown the towel in on next season, if you ask me . If they win great, they’ll try their best in the beginning, but I don’t think they are trying to maximize wins next season. So why not develop a QB?
Still trying to put your own narrative on it. That’s not an honest discussion.
For the record I have zero issue with him going to OSU. Or any other school for that matter.
But for some reason you wish to spin that narrative.
Where did I say we wouldn’t or anything close to it?
I never even mentioned him to the Lions in this thread.
Personally I highly doubt we draft a QB at 7OA.
We’d be crazy not to, IMO, if Justin Fields falls to us.
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Not in this thread but in the past you have said you don’t want the Lions to draft him
If we drafted Fields at 7 I’m cool with it.
Your once again miss quoting me.
Context is very important thats why you should only talk about what’s been said in this thread.
For the record … I think the Lions have a decent QB in Goff and should give him every opportunity to be the starter. I personally wouldn’t draft a QB at 7OA unless Wilson or Lawrence fell to me. I honestly think we should grab a WR or Parsons if we stay at 7OA. But I’m all for a trade down.
I like Mac Jones and think the board under values him. I think he has a higher floor than Lance and Fields but a lower ceiling.
I like Justin Fields and think the board over hypes him. I think he’s more boom or bust than Jones but has a bigger upside.
I like Lance almost as much as Fields. I think he’s also a boom or bust guy with a ton of upside.
I’m not opposed to taking one of the top 5 QB’s but in all honesty I’d rather not. Mainly because I’m of the mindset that you always try to win now and Goff isn’t a bad QB. I think the team can be competitive this year with Goff.
I’m not a Michigan fan who hates OSU like you claim.
I have no problem with drafting OSU players like you claim.
I do not hate Okudah like you claimed.
I do not hate Fields like you claimed.
Hopefully that clears things up on where I stand.
I do not want Fields. I have no faith in big ten QB’s and feel that Fields will go the same route Haskins did.
Personally I’d pass on a QB in 2021 and go QB in 2022. Next years QB class has several QB’s that are better options than anyone not named Lawrence in 2021.
Slough, Howell, Rattler and Slovis are all better options if you ask me.
I’d let all our free agents go via FA. Even Golladay … I’d clear out the dead weight on the roster. Then trade down from 7OA and stock pike picks. I wouldn’t chase anyone in FA. Stock pile comp picks by letting FA’s go.
Let Chase Daniels or Blough start in 2021. Basically tank for the 2022 class. I’m sure we’d be a top 2 pick if not the 1OA and get the best QB in next years class.
You get a year to fix your OL, DL and get younger at WR before bringing on a new QB.
Unless there is someone else named Air2theThrown
Contest matters you can’t seem to grasp that.
The question was who you liked out of 3 QB’s? I posted I like Fields the least.
I’ve repeated said for the last year that I like Fields. In a lot of threads. Ive also said I think you all over hype him and that I liked Wilson and Lawrence better.
Currently right now I like Fields a slightly more than Lance.
For some reason your on a vendetta to try to paint how a feel in negative light just like you did with Okudah. Even though I repeatedly said that I liked Okudah just not at 3OA.
That’s all perfectly reasonable.
I know this because I agree with it and am, you know, the voice of reason.
My stance has never changed on the kid. Although I’ve flip flopped him and Lance a few times. Other than that I’ve been pretty steady.