And you are not anymore. Air i have a tremendous amount of respect for you. But it is clear that your not optimistic about this team. I am though. It is a known fact that I haven’t been around much. In my time away I have made more Lions connections, some even insider connections, and people in the building LOVE MCDC. He has the full support of the Detroit Lions and the vision they have as an organization. The man isn’t going anywhere. I can defend him till I am blue in the face. And yes 3-14 run was not the best of moves…but did anyone really expect Boyle to complete that pass? Did you not see the picks he threw? I am telling you…swift IS the offense. I can defend him if I believe this roster at the most important positions is SHIT and I want the first overall pick more then anything that happens this year…BIG WHOOP we won 5 games and miss out on an all world talent. We are rebuilding. It is very easy to defend him. If every game was like philly and cincy then no, there is no defense…but that isn’t the case. Mark my words. The Detroit Lions will be winners with Dan Campbell. They will win playoff games. The Detroit Lions will change their history with Dan Campbell. I am fine eating crow on this if I am wrong. But if I am wrong then we are all doomed to more Detroit lions suckiness.
Are we to assume that trying to win is tucking your tail?
LIONS analytics = Swift is a statistically better option for gaining 15 yards than Boyle’s arm.
Best available without a huge cap hit. Situational awareness. I don’t think anyone on this board would agree that “win now” approach is the way to go with this.
You have WAY more football knowledge than me. Not gonna pretend otherwise. This feels like a non-football/football conversation.
I can relate to this, for sure. LOL.
I said that, because your response and languaging feels emotionally charged. That’s the problem with text.
Agreed → This year
…and → Next year (they will be different chapters of the same story).
Truthfully, I think we’ll win more next year than we otherwise would have because of ease of schedule. I don’t feel we’ll have a true depiction of what’s here for 2 more years?
I get the pissed-offedness that’s showing up on the board. I am always the last one to lose faith in a staff, and I’m aware of that too. LOL
Your one of my favorite posters but I feel your missing what I’m saying.
What your doing is making excuses for a winless season. There’s just no excuse to be winless. None.
Your saying it’s ok because expectations are low. I’m saying that just because expectations are low it doesn’t excuse mistakes by the HC, GM and staff in general. DC has made a ton of mistakes. Even you admit this.::: see below.
But I disagree in the improving dept. We are a winless team and can’t seem to close out games. Show me a couple wins and I’ll agree that we’re improving. But I see a team that’s worse than last years team and is winless.
About the better over time comment at the end of the quote.
In order to get better over time you have to try. What I am saying is in order to get better over time they need to be throwing on 3rd and long. They need to be converting on 3rd down. The Lions are one of the worst teams in the NFL at converting on 3rd down. The Lions need to take shots down field. Failing to do so puts them at a huge disadvantage.
Running on 3-14 isn’t trying. It’s giving up.
Right - SO important. I think they’re doing the best they can w/the “talent” they currently have, and they acquired their guys with the intent of future building, almost disregarding winning this year. Truth might be in middle, but I feel they lean heavy this way, if not completely.
LOTS of the guys agree w/you
Truth here. How much will he defer to the OC, when we get one?
What type of OC do we get? How good are they at their job?
Lots TBD. IMO, Dan is just a leader of humans. He needs football guys to help him. I would have passed on that play too, man. I was not disappointed that he didn’t. I think this year is all about growth, development of talent, seeing who gets cut next year, etc. We’ll have 50% roster turnover. it’s gonna be totally different, next year.
I get you, I just feel → Massively inconclusive.
Well, @Air2theThrown because of the respect that I have for you I won’t keep pushing the issue like I am known to do around here. I am not trying to go at you and my “lazy take” comment historically is given to those who truly do have a lazy take here and I am trying to be antagonistic, I shouldn’t have used it here. I just don’t see the glaring mistakes that you see, and yes I am saying the regime isn’t perfect, but that is coming more from the prospect that no one is perfect and I am honestly good with the progress thus far. I mean, we just traded Mathew Frickon Stafford and replaced him with crapola Goff…was not expecting much. Anyways, Happy Thanksgiving brother, I hope you are good.
@Air2theThrown and for the record on of my buddies is a NFL scout and happens to also be a diehard lions fan and we are both in a chat that is a mix of NFL media people, fans and the like and he “fundamentally disagrees with a play being run on 3rd and 14 that has a 10% chance of working” and when they ran it in the game I was in the stands going “what the fuck was that?”. Same respond I also had when Boyle threw the ball most times too. 
I asked this in another thread what I’m about to ask here
First the set-up:
Lynn has been a successful OC in the league for years. He coached Herbert last year with success. He’s always leaned towards the run game but he’s never been shy about taking shots.
I think Lynns lean towards the run game is why Dan hired him. Dan wants a smash mouth style of football team. That’s why he went trenches via the draft over skill positions.
Why is Lynn the scape goat for the Lions failure on offense?
Ask yourself this….
Both Boyle and Goff can’t seem to complete the deep pass. Why?
With DC calling the plays over Lynn did our passing game improve? No it got worse because we leaned even harder on the run game. We converted fewer 3rd downs as a result.
Honestly I think Dan just wants to play smash mouth 70’s style football. It all falls on Dan.
I don’t think Lynn was the problem.
So to answer your question on what type of OC we will get? We will probably hire an ex RB to be our OC. Someone like Duce Staley.
Because they Suuuuuck, look unmotivated, let go of things that they were initially showing signs of growth.
When run game started to slide, pass game got even worse than it used to be (never was good).
…Injuries haven’t helped
Because we only have 2 weapons that are easy to plan against.
Anyone can pretend thier opinion is something other than an opinion, but the truth is always in the middle. Lots of gray area - zero black and white.
Truth will reveal itself over time.
Well I think the truth is in the results and product that’s placed on the field. It’s easy to see.
I have no idea, I haven’t asked him about it.
Hoping…
Someone who is good at X’s and O’s, who can inspire and and teach. I feel like the reasons the last guy were in the dog house is because he wasn’t liked. Not an energetic match for what we had going on.
I am not a mind reader, and won’t pretend to know. I also won’t pretend that someone other than Holmes and Campbell know…cuz they don’t.
Thanks for the conversation, my bro
Yes…and it will be easy to see what happens next year too. 
Is it “plain to see” after one play?
One series?
One quarter?
One half?
One game?
1/2 a season?
…you see where I’m going with this.
Ummm
Context is important. You should quote the entire statement so that it’s clear what point I was making.
Here is what I actually said.
I firmly believe this. Some fans act like this roster isn’t good enough to win a single game. They make excuses for coaching mistakes based of this perceived notion. We’ve had plenty of close games that we could have been won with better coaching and game management.
If you have something to add or wish to debate this than say so but to misquote someone and just leave an ummm isn’t really adding much to the conversation.
Do you disagree that this team is good enough to win 4-5 games with better coaching?
Do you disagree that with some better roster moves by Holmes this team could be competitive?
There’s a fine line between a 5-12 team, and a team that’s actually competitive.
Let’s hear your take!
If he turns it around next year then he deserves credit for that. If he puts up another crappy season and can’t win a game by Thanksgiving than he deserves the heat too.
Pretty simple.
Great take, atrocious is being very kind, your very polite.
Yes - agreed.
He doesn’t deserve to coach this team unless he gets a good offensive play caller,could be young up coming coach for offense coordinator but someone with a offensive mind. Head coach is fine for Campbell but oversee the whole team not just one part.
I didn’t misquote you. Don’t start that nonsense. I didn’t add anything to the debate because I felt you were debating yourself with those statements.
Sure you did … you took a fragment of a paragraph to show it out of context. Instead of quoting the full statement made by me.
If you disagree with the statement then let’s hear your thoughts on it.
If you feel I’m debating myself then I have no idea how you came to that conclusion. My statements and thoughts haven’t wavered. Please explain how your coming to that conclusion.