For the Rams I think its okay for them to focus in on who Stafford is right now vs in his 6th season. They are in win now mode and this was a win now move. They also traded for the current version of Matt, so the past version isn’t particularly relevant. For Lions fans and others on the other side of things, I do believe it is an error to compare the two guys directly in their 2021 versions. Since Goff is only 26 it makes alot of sense to factor in where he could be between now and 33 like Stafford.
Its an odd year for QBs and teams are being super aggressive in how they are going after them. I think some fans take that to mean that the QBs are better than other years, rather than teams just being willing to pay a higher price for them this year. I definitely don’t see this as becoming a trend (4 QBs in the top 4 to 7 picks).
To be fair… I think most people here that would open to drafting a QB at #7 are focusing on the mock drafts (ie DJ 3.0) that have Fields slipping to the #7 pick.
And some may think Fields is the 4th or 5th best QB in the draft.
However, there are some sites (SI.com) and “analysts” (Kiper, Klatt) that have Fields as high as #2 still. It also wouldn’t surprise me if several NFL teams have Fields as their #2 QB.
Also… there are people who think 4 QBs in this draft may all be better than the #1 QB in the 2022 draft. I personally think it is too early to say that… because all of the 2022 QBs have another full year to get better.
If the coaches and leadership did their job with Goff, Goff has already been honestly told… if a QB we want falls to 7th pick we may take him and you have to be good with that…
If our new coaches and scouts can find the next PM in the QBs left on the board at 7, why would you not pull the trigger…?
They need to be ready for both scenarios and I feel certain Hoff knows they “could” grab a QB at 7 regardless imho
I think the logic you are using is flawed. The players in 22 will have an additional year of development and there will be other QBs that aren’t even on the radar yet. Playing time and experience are huge components in skill development, are they not? Might your rankings change by April 2022 or are they static?
If the new staff believes the QB sitting there when the Lions are on the clock is franchise altering, they have to select them. I am not qualified to make that decision, however, based on my observations I don’t see any of the QBs outside of Lawrence as a lock and therefore I would roll with the Goffer.
My intention is not to be contentious, just expressing an opinion…like yourself. I know you and other like Fields and in some cases Lance. While talented, all the prospects have question marks and this year specifically is more difficult to evaluate prospects. Goff is here for 2 years minimum and outside of Lawrence, nothing about the other 4 QBs screams franchise altering to my novice eyes.
I guess we’ll cross that bridge when we get there.
You’re saying teams plural. There’s only been one move, SF to Miami’s spot. They moved up for the 3rd best QB. Maybe it does actually say something about this crop of QBs.
This is all conjecture of course but even with the financial investment in him, if Goff throws 16 TDs and 20 INTs, Holmes, MCDC & co will be looking at a different QB.
I am not rooting for this to happen, I hope Goff is good but even on the rams, with a lot of solid talent around him, he never impressed me nor did I ever search him out to be on my Fantasy team. I know I know stats don’t win games but good stats are precursors to a higher probability of victory.
My point is, despite financial investment, Goff will have to play well next year to not be in the hot seat, QB drafted this year or not.
I’m surprised at the number of fans who think we should sacrifice the future and trade up when we could get our guy with one pick.
We already been through the “he’s only the 4th best QB” argument fallacy.
Imagine passing on Patrick Mahomes or Watson or Lamar Jackson in 2017 because the next two years you might get Josh Rosen or the next Daniel Jones. Or Dwayne Haskins or Drew Lock. Ask those teams how hard it is. I remember when the Bears thought it was easy and drafted Mitch Trubisky.
Part of the gamble here is assuming teams that don’t need a QB will be picking high… You can trade up, sometimes, but its extremely rare to trade up and get the QB that everybody wants. And then you have to hope you didn’t give up your future for a bust.
Oh, they’ll definitely change. I’m sure there’s someone who I have no idea about who I’ll love next year.
That said…
Lawrence and Fields were better as sophomores than any of the guys in the '22 class were. The only real difference was Covid, which we still don’t really know what it’s effects were.
For the record, I’m where HSV and Line are. I don’t want Jones. Any of the other four should certainly be in play, although our evaluators know best. Towards the OP’s reasons for not taking a QB:
If Campbell and Holmes wanted “their guy” in the draft, they accept the panthers offer for stafford and trade 7 and 8 + to get to #1 or 2 in this draft.
You guys can hope all you want that fields falls and then the lions stay and take him. If he does fall they are trading the pick for a nice haul (because he’s such a talent, right? Or did he fall because no one thinks he is? ) or they pass because Goff is already their guy.
They chose the Rams package because Goff is the guy…I mean I don’t see it any other way. What they did to swing stafford for Goff (a very solid, 26 year old starting QB) and multiple future 1st round picks (in case he isn’t) is nothing short of genius. Those future firsts are further evidence that Goff is going to get a serious look the next 1-2 years.
QB is in fact, off the board IMO in the upcoming draft
I like Wes’s thought here:
“For the Rams I think its okay for them to focus in on who Stafford is right now vs in his 6th season. They are in win now mode and this was a win now move. They also traded for the current version of Matt, so the past version isn’t particularly relevant. For Lions fans and others on the other side of things, I do believe it is an error to compare the two guys directly in their 2021 versions. Since Goff is only 26 it makes alot of sense to factor in where he could be between now and 33 like Stafford.”
Yes it is okay for the Rams to shoot for the fence overall. I totally agree with JDrik09 when he notes:
“They chose the Rams package because Goff is the guy…I mean I don’t see it any other way. What they did to swing stafford for Goff (a very solid, 26 year old starting QB) and multiple future 1st round picks (in case he isn’t) is nothing short of genius. Those future firsts are further evidence that Goff is going to get a serious look the next 1-2 years.”
I see Goff as a better Stafford this point five years in. Matt looked amazing and them regressed in 2012 and 2013 and there were reasons for that. Matt NEEDED Caldwell and he got a guy who could take him to the next level. Goff has never had a poor of a season as Stafford in 2013 and Goff hasn’t had Calvin Johnson to throw the ball too. I think the Rams are stupid to sell out for a possibly magical 2021 when they have a guy who with work can get the job done. Again, Goff is better now than Stafford was in 2013. I’ll take that as I think we fleeced the Rams in this deal.
If Goff stinks replace him in three years with the 2023 draft when we also have two first round picks.
I am not passing up a college WR with 43 TDs, or Chase who had 20 TDs in a single season or the best OT in the draft or the best LBer in the draft because we are worried Goff isn’t very good. That argument makes zero sense to me.
Or, the most likely outcome, that both groups think they’re right, will probably happen. And that’s my biggest fear – Goff is ‘just good enough’ to maintain his starter status, and if we don’t draft a QB this year, there won’t be a huge push to draft one in coming years, because he is something like the 12th or 15th best QB. Just good enough. I want a top 5 QB. I don’t think Goff can be that. So we settle for being middling if we don’t put pressure on him.
So while both sides in this thread, draft a qb don’t draft a qb, have good points, there is a point that needs to be considered which hasn’t had much discussion when it comes to Goff. I read the thread somewhat quickly so perhaps I missed it.
We have two guys in the front office; a GM and an Asst GM as well as a former Rams coach on the staff who probably know a lot more about what happened with the Rams. They were with the Rams during Goff’s strong playoff run and the down year or two.
Holmes knows what was going on with the team how much the injuries and or loss of RB’s and WR’s impacted the offense. He knows Goff and McVey and probably has a good idea of where the actual issue is/was in that relationship. He knows where Goff struggled and needs improvement as well.
So they may actually be the only ones who can address why the Rams, a winning team, got rid of Goff. It probably isn’t as simple as some are trying to state and they know the behind the scene story far more than we do.
So, I’m good with whatever direction they decide, draft a qb or don’t.
If Goff is a quality starter and you draft a QB this year than you wasted a 1st if the guy can’t unseat Goff… so your mortgaging the future.
If in 2022 or 23 you’ve determined Goff isn’t the guy then your probably drafting pretty high right? At most it might cost you an additional first rounder to get the guy you want. (Cost would be the same then) … Maybe less. Maybe nothing more at all.
Meanwhile your rookie coach and GM are a year or two smarter and have a better idea what they need. They’ve had a few years to build up the talent to give that rookie the best chance to succeed.
Point being I think it’s easy to argue that you could sacrifice your future more by drafting a QB now.
Imagine taking Dwayne Haskins, Sam Darnold, Mitch Trubisky or Josh Rosen when the next draft might have Payton Manning, Tom Brady, or John Elway in it?
That argument goes both ways.
Your going to have to make the correct pick. Regardless. I think the odds are better after our rookie HC and GM have a little more experience under their belts.
The point is that if Goff stinks you’ll be drafting high anyways right? … it’s not hard to move up a few spots to get the QB you covet if you have to … you could be drafting 1st if he sucks bad enough. If he’s good enough to win a few games you may stay put and take the next Justin Herbert (like SD) or have to trade up a few spots to get the next Mahomes (Like KC)
If Goff sucks where do you think we would be drafting at? Then ask yourself what it would cost you (if anything) to get one of these QB’s and where they went in the last few drafts. It’s not hard to do but you still have to make the correct pick.
Herbert went 6OA
Allen went 7OA
Jackson went 32OA
Mahomes went 10OA
Watson went 12OA
) or they pass because Goff is already their guy.