Who is a 'Brad Holmes' draft pick?: Diving into Brad's pick history

So all year (and especially now as we’re heading into the offseason), I’ve seen names thrown around that the Lions should draft where I just think…‘That doesn’t seem like this regime’s kind of guy at all.’ So, I wanted to do a little case study and see if I could find any trends on the guys Brad/Dan are looking for and what Brad has specifically said about the draft picks they’ve made after they were drafted. I wanted to break this down into a few parts that I think are a necessity when figuring out who is a ‘Brad Holmes guy’:

  • Physical Talent, which we will measure using RAS scores.
  • Performance, which we will use PFF ranking/scores (I know people may disagree with their system, but they cover almost everything and really, just using them as a point of reference)
  • Intangibles, which I will reference what/if anything Brad said about these guys after they were picked.

So let’s take a look at the data from 2021:

PICK POS PLAYER RAS PFF RANK PFF 1 PFF 2 PFF 3 INTANGIBLES
21.7 OT SEWELL 8.99 4 N/A 95.8 84.0 Not just athletic, toughness, grit, football family
21.41 DT ONWUZURIKE 8.73 78 N/A 82.5 90.8 Personality and fire, versatility
21.72 DT MCNEILL 8.53 54 90.7 79.4 71.8 Versatility
21.101 CB MELIFONWU 9.69 70 78.8 72.0 75.8 Versatility
21.112 WR ST. BROWN 7.14 87 71.7 73.9 75.0 instictintive, tough, saavy, willing to block, tenacity, football character
21.113 LB BARNES 8.42 131 57.7 62.9 58.4 Elite football character / intangibles
21.257 RB JEFFERSON 2.28 207 79.3 73.0 80.9 Instinctive
  • Traded #153 & 2022 4th for #113 and #257

Some quotes regarding the draft/process after the 2021 draft that I think are pertinent:

  • On culture or schemetic fit being more important: “More culture fit. Toughness, passion, grit. Does he take plays off or does he not? Does he love football or does he not? To us, that’s more important than if he’s a press or zone CB”

  • On the draft process: “Stick with the plan: Get the best football player. You might say it’s GM speak, but NO! If it’s a OT, a DB, etc - it doesn’t matter, we want the best player”

  • “Tough, physical, smart, explosive, instinctive players” regarding Levi, Alim, Iffy

  • On Dan/Brad’s conversations regarding their process: “We aren’t just looking for talented football players, we’re looking for football players who have talent”

And now the data from 2022:

PICK POS PLAYER RAS PFF RANK PFF 1 PFF 2 PFF 3 INTANGIBLES
22.2 DE HUTCHINSON 9.88 1 94.5 82.5 82.9 Really High Motor, loves football
22.12 WR WILLIAMS N/A 9 81.6 55.5 59.5 Tough, gritty, “dog”, loves football
22.46 DE PASCHAL 9.7 44 90.0 77.2 74.7 Versatility, elite character
22.97 S JOSEPH N/A 73 90.4 73.9 52.6
22.177 TE MITCHELL N/A 109 61.4 73.5 70.2
22.188 LB RODRIGUEZ 9.47 153 85.7 69.9 72.1
22.217 LB HOUSTON 7.93 N/A N/A N/A N/A
22.237 CB LUCAS 8.89 336 60.5 80.3 61.6
  • Traded #32, #34, and #66 to MIN for #12 and #46
  • Traded #181 to PHI for #188 and #237

Some quotes regarding the draft/process after the 2022 draft that I think are pertinent:

  • On drafting a certain position/side of the ball: “Don’t go in saying: “Don’t draft offense.” Don’t pass up good players. If the best player is an offensive guard, you don’t pass them up just because they’re not a DT or a LB. We don’t go into the draft, anchored to a position or a side (offense/defense). That’s how we roll, we just want the best player.”

  • On physical traits: “Low height/bulk/arm length? What else does he bring? Does he have explosiveness, motor, instincts or some other plus quality to compensate for any shortcomings?”

  • On taking a lot of team captains: “We look into the intangibles. Heavily scrutinized. Football character. How much passion & desire for game? That dictates success. Physical traits don’t mean anything without drive and conviction.”

  • On Day 3: “How can they (prospective picks) help on special teams?”

So what does this all mean? What can we conclude from looking at the data?

Let’s start with the PFF grades: Holmes appears to place a high standard on on the field performance, particularly in their most previous season:

  • The average PFF grade of the final season for picks in 2021 was 79.5, with 5 of the scores being 78.8+ which includes a 57.7 score from Barnes (more on him in a minute)

  • The average PFF grade of the final season for picks in 2022 was 85.4(!) with 4 of the 6 elgibile picks (Houston wasn’t graded) having a 90+ rating, 2 of them having an 80+ rating, and also includes a 60.5 from Lucas (more on him in a minute)

  • When taking the grades from the last three years for all players: only 9 of a possible 40 scores were under 70. Two of these were from Jamo’s years at OSU where he wasn’t on the field much at all, 6 of them are from Barnes/Lucas (more on them in a minute), one of these was Rodriguez with a 69.9 rating, barely missing the threshold.

Okay, so what about Barnes and Lucas? Good! I’m glad you asked, let’s talk about RAS:

Brad Holmes undoubtedly draft athletically gifted freaks.

  • The RAS average in 2021 was 7.68, which also includes a 2.28 from Jermar Jefferson. Without JJ’s RAS, the class averages 8.58 (and Amon Ra brings that down slightly with a 7.14, which is the 2nd lowest in Brad’s drafting history.)
  • The RAS average in 2022 was 9.174(!). Williams, Joseph, and Mitchell didn’t do enough to fill out an entire RAS profile, but I don’t even know if this number goes down after they test.

Now, on to the third criteria, intangibles:

This one is a little tougher, because we’re never going to sit down with these guys and get to know them one on one like the coaches are. The best we can do is rely on secondhand info in the media, which may or may not be accurate. But from Brad’s press conference comments we can see some trends here:

  • Football Guys: Love & Passion for the game above all else
  • Motor: Ties in with above, but players who don’t quit and are giving 100% every time they’re on the field
  • Versatility: If guys can contribute in multiple ways/schemes/looks, you can play for the Lions
  • GRIT: A Brad guy has to be resilient. Has to be able to take some shots and get back up./
  • Leadership: This ties into character a bit, but a lot was made about the fact that almost every player the Lions drafted in 2022 was a team leader or captain in the locker room. Brad Holmes is serious when he says culture is more important than scheme.

So, what does a Brad Holmes draft pick look like? Well, I don’t think we’ll ever know exactly for sure. But I think some of these numbers help lay the groundwork for what some of these stuff looks like for those of us who like numbers.

To me looking at the data, it’s pretty clear that there is a pretty big emphasis on how the players finished their college careers. And not only their final year, but gradings throughout college being anywhere from good to decent. There are not a lot of bad seasons of football in those PFF grades. And in the rare cases where maybe the performance wasn’t there (Barnes/Lucas), their athletic gifts and character made Brad believe that they had the drive/tools to become performers in the NFL.

But not only do they have to perform well, they have to be physically gifted. The RAS scores are kind of crazy. I’d be interested to see how Brad’s two drafts stack up to others. But other than Jermar, who is a crazy outlier, all but 2 picks are in the 8.42+ range.

Of course, this is a small sample size of only 2 years, but I think for me, at least, it gives me a better idea of what Brad might be looking at when I see these things all laid out and may help me looking at potential draft prospects to see how they line up with what Brad has done in the past. Hopefully this info is useful to someone else too because I had fun looking into this.

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Good stuff. Thank you for sharing. Enjoyed the overview

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It seems kind of simple.

We have watched Lions regimes draft players that were good athletes… but not great football players… and they failed.

We have seen players drafted that were really productive in college… but didn’t have enough athleticism to translate to the NFL level.

And… we have seen the Lions draft guys that seemed to have the athleticism needed… succeed in college… but then struggle as a pro because they didn’t have the drive (character) to be great in the pro game.

Holmes and Campbell seem to be off to a good start on identifying players that can pass the testing in all phases…
hope that continues and we don’t “bite” on any cheese that presents itself when the “needs” become fewer….

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Yeah really good stuff. You really nailed the grit+character+motor stuff in a better way than I ever do (I call it the no-turds test lol).

Though I will say that two guys he was said to be leading the charge for in LA, Cooper Kupp and Jordan Fuller, both had low RAS scores. So I think while he prefers athletes, the small sample size is disguising the fact that he can evaluate the guys who are more football player than athlete as well (ARSB sort of falls into this category too).

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Great breakdown @Davicus. Well done.

One other thing… every player we’ve taken so far has experience at the power 5 level. In fact, the only non-power 5 player we’ve taken was James Houston from Jackson State who was receiving power 5 caliber coaching from Deion Sanders after transferring from Florida.

I think it would be a cool exercise if after the combine and all the RAS scores cames out if we could get all of our draft junkies to collaborate and come up with a list of 30 or so players maybe a week before the draft, and then after the draft we can see how many picks we got right.

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Yes, I’ll be curious to see RAS scores and start putting them up with the PFF scores to see if there are guys I think fall into the trends that we see over Brad’s two years. That’s kind of why I wanted to look into this so I could see if there was any sort of ‘tangible’ data to rely on in narrowing down who might be an option vs. just guys I think are good.

I say ‘tangible’ because people have mixed feelings on PFF, but I’m using it mostly as a tool to see what they had Brad’s picks rated and drawing conclusions from that. But it seems like PFF would agree that most of Brad’s guys are ballers. I’m still shocked that except for Barnes the 2021 draft had zero players with a score below 71.8 in three years. And while a couple more exceptions in 2022, the scores on the picks last year before coming out is absolutely bonkers.

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Kupp was a guy that that had a lower RAS score in underwear… but also has some GPS times that raised eyebrows.

I’m not sure about Fuller… and GPS times… but did find he might have ran better in games than he did in spandex.

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Yeah that’s fair, Kent needs to figure out a way to make GPS times part of RAS. So maybe we need another way to say Holmes prefers great athletes without using RAS scores? Eh, I don’t know. It probably works well enough.

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Just an FYI regarding Fuller - his PFF scores:

image

Yep, passes the Brad check. Nothing below 70 and a high grade in his final year.

And can’t find all of Kupp’s grades, but did find this regarding his final season in college:
image

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I have been lamenting the fact that GPS times are pretty much not available on a regular basis.

I mean… these companies do want to make money right???

I realize they get paid by NFL teams for that info…
but seems to me they could make a lot more money by publishing some… or a LOT…. of that data.

Maybe there is a contractual thing we don’t know about???

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I think that has to be it. Otherwise it makes no sense.

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I love the research into the PFF scores, but then I’m a big fan of theirs. I think some people on here won’t like it as much.

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I’m really curious to see how it lines up in this draft. Because if the trend carries on, I lot of these CBs I like don’t pass the test. Especially first round…the PFF scores for the early guys are pretty high. 95.8 for Sewell, 94.5 for Hutch, 81.6 for JaMo being the low one, but:
Smith - 65.1
Ringo - 71.4
Jones - 71.5
Gonzalez - 81.2
Porter Jr - 73.2
And not only are these low, but the other years have tons of below 70s. It just doesn’t pass the trend test, especially taking into account where Brad repeatedly says he won’t get pigeonholed into drafting a position.

I think it’s more likely based on PFF score history (and without knowing RAS and interviews) that a guy like Branch (89.5 - nothing below 72), Johnson (81.6), Witherspoon (92), Forbes (87.2) are taken at the tail end of the first/early second or later a guy like Riley Moss (81.4,80.1,78.5) vs any of the ‘likely’ CBs getting taken at all, let alone at #6. Well, at least what the data seems to indicate so far…

I’ve very, very interested to see how another year either confirms or completely destroys the data from the first two years. lol

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That was a full-blown, well-written article. I hope you’re a sports reporter in real life, cuz I’d read your stuff.

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Clark Phillips too, 66.7 → 74.6 → 85.2. I’d probably put Gonzalez in that group too, he improved year over year and once he tests like a freak, 81.2 is gonna be fine as a grade IMO.

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I’ve looked this over a couple of times and this sure does make it look like Christian Gonzalez will be the CB we prefer among all the guys at the top. It’ll be interesting to see what Kelee Ringo’s RAS ends up being but I don’t think he’s shown the production Brad likes to see. I mean Marvin Harrison absolutely cooked him until he got hurt. So did Cedric Tillman for a good while.

It looks like Cam Smith will probably be the first CB we eliminate from the discussion, followed by Porter and Ringo. Then we’ll debate taking Gonzalez at 6 or taking Witherspoon/Phillips at 18.

It would be interesting for someone to post all of Brian Branch’s PFF grades and everything to add him to this discussion.

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Gonzales improvement from game 1 to game 10 just this year was very impressive.

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Great stuff here. It does feel like the early favorites would be Gonzalez and Branch. Two guys I like a lot so I’m cool with that :sunglasses:

I do think we will need RAS scores to paint a more complete picture

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RAS is a good measure. We just need to correct/adjust the 40 time when a guy times slower than his game speed (Jermar Jefferson).

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To be fair, Marvin Harrison is a freak and would probably be the first receiver taken this year if he was draft eligible and likely a top 5 pick.

Branch (89.5 - nothing below 72), Antonio Forbes (81.6), Witherspoon (92), Forbes (87.2)

PFF top 30 seniors

PFF top 10 LB - Not a deep class

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